UK Defence Forum

dmereifield wrote: ↑18 Mar 2023, 18:43 We need the current government to sign up to some Gordon Brown style Carrier contracts to be sure of that....

mrclark303 wrote: ↑18 Mar 2023, 19:37

dmereifield wrote: ↑18 Mar 2023, 18:43 We need the current government to sign up to some Gordon Brown style Carrier contracts to be sure of that....

I hope they do.....

The looming UK general election must be a slight concern to the Japanese government, in this critical moment when the embryonic corporate structure of Tempest is being formed.

I am sure they wil pressure the UK government to sign up and equally pressure the Labour party to confirm their commitment to it.....

Meriv9 wrote: ↑18 Mar 2023, 19:51 TSR2 is the Uk version of Canadian Avro C-105 Drama?

mrclark303 wrote: ↑18 Mar 2023, 19:37

dmereifield wrote: ↑18 Mar 2023, 18:43 We need the current government to sign up to some Gordon Brown style Carrier contracts to be sure of that....

I hope they do.....

The looming UK general election must be a slight concern to the Japanese government, in this critical moment when the embryonic corporate structure of Tempest is being formed.

I am sure they wil pressure the UK government to sign up and equally pressure the Labour party to confirm their commitment to it.....

SD67 wrote: ↑18 Mar 2023, 20:57

Meriv9 wrote: ↑18 Mar 2023, 19:51 TSR2 is the Uk version of Canadian Avro C-105 Drama?

Much worse

Spitfire9 wrote: ↑19 Mar 2023, 00:37

mrclark303 wrote: ↑18 Mar 2023, 19:37

dmereifield wrote: ↑18 Mar 2023, 18:43 We need the current government to sign up to some Gordon Brown style Carrier contracts to be sure of that....

I hope they do.....

The looming UK general election must be a slight concern to the Japanese government, in this critical moment when the embryonic corporate structure of Tempest is being formed.

I am sure they wil pressure the UK government to sign up and equally pressure the Labour party to confirm their commitment to it.....

I hope we don't have a trade agreement with Japan. They can let us know that if we back out of this co-operative agreement there won't be a co-operative trade agreement for a long time.

PS The geniuses who told us that getting out of the EU was a brilliant idea, an EU all of whose members were nasty johnny foreigners except for us, told us that the UK would enjoy great trade advantages once we left. The reality was the opposite and we desperately need trade agreements with major economies.

Spitfire9 wrote: ↑19 Mar 2023, 00:37

mrclark303 wrote: ↑18 Mar 2023, 19:37

dmereifield wrote: ↑18 Mar 2023, 18:43 We need the current government to sign up to some Gordon Brown style Carrier contracts to be sure of that....

I hope they do.....

The looming UK general election must be a slight concern to the Japanese government, in this critical moment when the embryonic corporate structure of Tempest is being formed.

I am sure they wil pressure the UK government to sign up and equally pressure the Labour party to confirm their commitment to it.....

I hope we don't have a trade agreement with Japan. They can let us know that if we back out of this co-operative agreement there won't be a co-operative trade agreement for a long time.

PS The geniuses who told us that getting out of the EU was a brilliant idea, an EU all of whose members were nasty johnny foreigners except for us, told us that the UK would enjoy great trade advantages once we left. The reality was the opposite and we desperately need trade agreements with major economies.

Spitfire9 wrote: ↑19 Mar 2023, 00:37

mrclark303 wrote: ↑18 Mar 2023, 19:37

dmereifield wrote: ↑18 Mar 2023, 18:43 We need the current government to sign up to some Gordon Brown style Carrier contracts to be sure of that....

I hope they do.....

The looming UK general election must be a slight concern to the Japanese government, in this critical moment when the embryonic corporate structure of Tempest is being formed.

I am sure they wil pressure the UK government to sign up and equally pressure the Labour party to confirm their commitment to it.....

I hope we don't have a trade agreement with Japan. They can let us know that if we back out of this co-operative agreement there won't be a co-operative trade agreement for a long time.

PS The geniuses who told us that getting out of the EU was a brilliant idea, an EU all of whose members were nasty johnny foreigners except for us, told us that the UK would enjoy great trade advantages once we left. The reality was the opposite and we desperately need trade agreements with major economies.

SD67 wrote: ↑19 Mar 2023, 09:44 Interesting one for historians

Personally I think if there were no Brexit we’d be looking at a maybe 20% share in FCAS, maybe even alignment of SSNs with France ie adopting LEU. I don’t think 5 eyes would last long term given the EUs defence ambitions.

TheLoneRanger wrote: ↑19 Mar 2023, 09:54

SD67 wrote: ↑19 Mar 2023, 09:44 Interesting one for historians

Personally I think if there were no Brexit we’d be looking at a maybe 20% share in FCAS, maybe even alignment of SSNs with France ie adopting LEU. I don’t think 5 eyes would last long term given the EUs defence ambitions.

EU has nothing to do with 5-eyes .... so its future has nothing to do with the EU.

SD67 wrote: ↑19 Mar 2023, 10:15

TheLoneRanger wrote: ↑19 Mar 2023, 09:54

SD67 wrote: ↑19 Mar 2023, 09:44 Interesting one for historians

Personally I think if there were no Brexit we’d be looking at a maybe 20% share in FCAS, maybe even alignment of SSNs with France ie adopting LEU. I don’t think 5 eyes would last long term given the EUs defence ambitions.

EU has nothing to do with 5-eyes .... so its future has nothing to do with the EU.

IMHO The EU have serious ambitions in terms of defence and intelligence sharing. For example a new EU institution opened in just 2020 - Intelligence College of Europe. and the ability of the UK to straddle those two communities would be put under severe strain medium term.

SD67 wrote: ↑19 Mar 2023, 12:37 " But Sir, He started it!"

Gtal wrote: ↑05 Mar 2023, 23:49

ThreeHeadedLion wrote: ↑05 Mar 2023, 23:04 By the time GCAP moves to induction stage, India will have a defense budget of over $250 billion. Any one who is not clinically insane would want to be a part of that. Especially given the potential for a huge order to replace the Su30 and the Mig29 fleets.

The big challenge is making a sale off the shelf and not getting them involved in the development. Also, the antagonistic relations that exist between Italy-India and Sweden-India are a big drag on the hopes of making such a sale. It would have been ideal if this was just a clean development between UK and Japan with India being a committed off the shelf customer. As things stand they will probably end up buying the American export variant or maybe the FCAS if the French can minimise the project dependence on Germany.

That's a weird logic,
India wants freedom of action, which they don't get under US ITAR.
That is why they buy French and Russian stuff.

FCAS will be completely ITAR free and provide them operational independence.

It's just that they might not get to buy any more of them after they go on a vicious warcrime spree and/or perpetrate large scale crimes against humanity like the Saudis.

ThreeHeadedLion wrote: ↑19 Mar 2023, 16:38 The big challenge is making a sale off the shelf and not getting them involved in the development. Also, the antagonistic relations that exist between Italy-India and Sweden-India are a big drag on the hopes of making such a sale. It would have been ideal if this was just a clean development between UK and Japan with India being a committed off the shelf customer. As things stand they will probably end up buying the American export variant or maybe the FCAS if the French can minimise the project dependence on Germany.