Air Command to 2030

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AndyC
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Air Command to 2030

Post by AndyC »

The clear winner from SDSR15 was the Royal Air Force with the announcement of two additional Typhoon Squadrons, an order for nine Boeing P-8 Poseidon maritime patrol aircraft, at least sixteen new long-range Protector UCAVs, two new Shadow R2 aircraft and the retention of a Hercules C4 Squadron.

By 2023 four frontline Squadrons will be available for QRA, three for swing-role operations (so that one can be deployed globally at any time), two for carrier operations (so that one is always at sea) plus the Flight in the Falklands. A tenth frontline Squadron could be created thanks to the Typhoon’s TyTAN programme. These will be supported by two UCAV Squadrons and six reserve Squadrons – one Operational Conversion Unit and one Test & Evaluation Squadron for each of the F-35B and Typhoon respectively plus two armed aggressor and exercise support Squadrons.

Since 2015, Air Command has gone beyond SDSR15 by ordering five Boeing E-7 Wedgetail AEW1 and committing to the upgrading of tranche 2 and 3 Typhoons with the world leading European Common Radar System Mark 2 (ECRS2) multi-function array AESA radar after 2025.

The 2020 four-year Spending Review allows for a 5% increase in real spending on day-to-day expenditure, including personnel. For the RAF that means an additional 1,600 full-time personnel which should be sufficient to stand up a tenth frontline Squadron, create a Squadron of Sea Protector UCAVs plus maintain and upgrade the Sentinel R2 Squadron.

A priority for the Integrated Review (IR) should be to join the French-Italian Ballistic Missile Defence project and order an initial total of 500 Aster 30 Block 1NT very long-range SAM, which are able to intercept ballistic missiles and aircraft up to 1,500 kilometres away. They should equip both Type 45 destroyers and a Squadron of twelve launch vehicles. The launch vehicles could be divided between three Flights and each assigned to a Sky Sabre Battery for the defence of the UK.

F-35B Lightning II

The F-35B Lightning II has principally been designed to operate from aircraft carriers. Each QE class aircraft carrier is capable of operating up to three Squadrons. Financial constraints and delays in the development of the aircraft have slowed down its entry into frontline service with the result that there will be just 42 F-35B aircraft in service by 2023. With so few it is inevitable that they will be required to concentrate on fleet air defence and anti-shipping, and mostly be carrier based.

Only when numbers are increased during the late 2020s and the third and fourth frontline Squadrons are stood up will there be sufficient aircraft for it to take on a significant land strike role. If the rate of purchasing new aircraft averages six per year after 2024 there will be 84 F-35B in service by 2030.

In its initial configuration the F-35B is rated to operate only AMRAAM AIM-120C5, ASRAAM Block 4 and Paveway IV. After 2024, the Block 4 software upgrade will enable the integration of the Meteor B JNAAM with Mitsubishi AESA seeker, ASRAAM Block 6 and SPEAR 3/-EW medium-range precision strike missiles.

In the fleet air defence role the F-35B is currently armed with four AMRAAM AIM-120C5 and two ASRAAM Block 4. After 2026, they will carry four Meteor B JNAAM and two ASRAAM Block 6. For anti-shipping, land strike and Suppression of Enemy Air Defences (SEAD) they will principally be armed with eight SPEAR 3/-EW missiles.

Peak Typhoon

In the short-term, the backbone of the air defence fighter force will continue to be the tranche 1 Typhoon. With the slow rate of purchasing the F-35B these older aircraft will continue in service until at least 2030. Their Captor M-Scan radar is the best in its class and due to regular software upgrades is able to match the performance of many more modern fixed plate smaller AESA radars in the air defence role. To remain capable of dealing with any likely threat these aircraft require a more advanced beyond-visual-range air-to-air missile. This is being achieved by the integration of the longer ranged AMRAAM AIM-120D which is equipped with the latest electronic countermeasures.

Tranche 1 aircraft will specialise in the QRA and red air roles with one Squadron based at RAF Lossiemouth and one at RAF Coningsby. This will ensure the maximum use of older airframes while preserving more advanced tranche 3 airframes to 2040 and beyond.

The latest tranche 2 and 3 Typhoons will be upgraded with the world leading ECRS2 multi-function array AESA radar after 2025. They should be further enhanced to carry six Meteor A BVRAAM and four ASRAAM Block 6 as their standard weapons mix in the QRA and air defence roles.

Project Centurion has led to the full integration of Paveway IV, Storm Shadow, Meteor A BVRAAM, Brimstone 3A and a common weapons launcher for all tranche 2 and 3 Typhoons. This is being followed by the integration of SPEAR 3/-EW under the Phase 4 Enhancements (P4E) programme.

There are plans for standing up an eighth frontline Typhoon Squadron by 2023 thanks to efficiencies delivered by the Typhoon Total Availability eNterprise (TyTAN) contract which will see more Typhoons available for frontline service. As a result, Air Command will be able to operate a total of ten frontline Squadrons. Additional efficiency savings have been made by retiring sixteen two-seat tranche 1 Typhoons in a Reduce to Produce (RTP) programme involving the recycling of spare parts.

MPA/ISTAR

The requirement for a long-range anti-submarine patrol aircraft to guard the approaches to Faslane, defend naval battle groups and cover the large areas of sea around the UK has been met by the purchase of nine Boeing P-8 Poseidon maritime patrol aircraft. The Poseidon has been purchased with as few modifications as possible to control cost. Each aircraft is equipped with 129 sonobuoys, five Mk 54 light torpedoes fitted with High Altitude Anti-submarine Weapons Capability (HAAWC) in a specialist anti-submarine warfare role, four long-range Harpoon II+ anti-shipping missiles and two AMRAAM AIM-120C5 for self-defence.

The only significant long-term modification of the Poseidon should be to integrate the UK’s Storm Shadow cruise missile to provide a long-range strike capability.

This leaves relatively few aircraft to cover a vast area of ocean. It has been estimated that a minimum of sixteen aircraft are required to meet the UK’s requirements. This is not affordable under budget constraints. A cost effective option would be to purchase eight Sea Protector UCAVs each capable of deploying up to 100 sonobuoys, two Mk 54 light torpedoes fitted with the HAAWC system and advanced maritime surveillance radar.

To improve land ISTAR and assist with future conflicts against insurgents the RAF will receive sixteen long-range Protector UCAV to replace its existing Reaper UCAV. These will usually be armed with up to twelve Brimstone 3A or Paveway IV and have more than twice the flight endurance.

A significant modernisation of the radar used for airborne and ground based early warning is being undertaken. Due to the age and increasing obsolescence of the E-3 Sentry aircraft the decision was taken in 2019 to purchase a more modern system, the Boeing E-7 Wedgetail AEW1. This has the advantage of being based on a similar Boeing 737NG airframe to the Poseidon, so saving on maintenance costs, and has been ordered with only minor modifications to minimise cost.

The long-range wide area battlefield surveillance Sentinel R1 is much in demand and should be upgraded and maintained in service for the foreseeable future along with the more tactical eight Shadow R1/2.

Complex Weapons: The Next Generation

The most significant gap in the UK’s defences is the lack of a Ballistic Missile Defence. The MoD should join the French-Italian project to upgrade the Aster 30 to Block 1NT (New Technology) standard to allow it to intercept Short and Medium Range Ballistic Missiles and aircraft up to 1,500 kilometres.

A number of new and upgraded complex weapons are already on order or under development and will enter service in the next ten years including:
• Meteor BVRAAM (B version) also known as the Joint New Air-to-Air Missile using an advanced Japanese AESA seeker provided by Mitsubishi and with clipped tail fins so that it is able to fit inside an F-35
• AMRAAM AIM-120D to supplement and replace the older AMRAAM AIM-120C5 on tranche 1 Typhoons plus give the Advanced Hawk and Poseidon an area defence capability
• ASRAAM Block 6 incorporating a new seeker designed for the CAMM family of Surface-to-Air Missiles with the capability to intercept incoming missiles
• Brimstone 3A anti-armour missile with double the range of its predecessor when launched from aircraft and Brimstone 3B to meet the Future Attack Helicopter Weapon (FAHW) requirement for Apache AH-64E and Wildcat AH1
• a Penetrator Warhead for Paveway IV and
• Sky Sabre ground based air defence system.

There is no doubt that ground based air defences are becoming more effective. One answer is the stealth of the F-35 but another is to extend the range of stealthy stand-off cruise missiles. Improvements in engine technology and the use of lighter materials are enabling these missiles to be effective at much longer ranges. The US has embarked on an ‘-Extended Range’ programme. SPEAR 4 should be more ambitious and aim to nearly double the range of the Storm Shadow missile to a maximum of 600 miles/1,000 kilometres.

The planned addition of a two-way datalink would enable retargeting so that Storm Shadow can be used against surface vessels and this would make it worthwhile integrating on the Poseidon, even if its range is not increased, in addition to the Typhoon.

The SPEAR 3 medium-range precision strike missile is being developed to enable the Suppression of Enemy Air Defences (SEAD) and the targeting of multiple mobile ground targets at distances of up to 90 miles/140 kilometres. In particular the SPEAR-EW variant will be a vital tool to enable both F-35B and Typhoon swing-role fighters to deal with mobile radar and SAM launchers in highly contested environments at the start of a conflict, while minimising their vulnerability. SPEAR 3/-EW will also be effective weapons against ship based missile launchers and radar which it could disable prior to the use of heavier anti-shipping missiles.

From 2031 air-launched Harpoon II+ and then Storm Shadow will be replaced by the air-launched variant of the Future Cruise/Anti-Ship Weapon (FC/ASW) developed under the SPEAR 5 programme. The ship-launched variant will equip Type 45 destroyers and Type 26 Global Combat Ships.

Hawk Replacement

UK air defence can be supplemented by armed aggressor, exercise support and advanced fast jet training aircraft. The Hawk T1/1A currently fulfils the first two of these roles but has already been in service for over forty years and is in need of replacement.

With the Red Arrows the Hawk T1/1A fulfils a valuable role promoting the RAF and British engineering. It is currently planned to be retired in 2030 and needs to be replaced by a British aircraft, which effectively means the Advanced Hawk.

In its aggressor and air combat training role with 100 Squadron the Hawk T1/1A could be replaced by a mixture of tranche 1 Typhoons and Advanced Hawks. In its maritime aggressor support role with 736 NAS it could also be replaced by the Advanced Hawk.

In an emergency, both the Advanced Hawk and the Hawk T2 could have the role of escorting significant air assets and defending them from the growing threat of Very Long Range Air-to-Air Missiles (VLRAAM) and Very Long Range Surface-to-Air Missiles (VLRSAM).

The Advanced Hawk is based on the airframe of the already in-service two seat Hawk T2 with a more powerful engine, new combat wing and digital controls. It should come equipped with fixed plate AESA radar together with two AMRAAM AIM-120D and two ASRAAM Block 6. Pairs of Advanced Hawks could be assigned the specific task of escorting Voyager KC2/3 aerial tankers and Air Seeker R1 ISTAR aircraft.

The RAF operates the Hawk T2 as its advanced fast jet training aircraft. While there is no internal space for radar, pairs of Hawk T2s could use Link 16 and be armed with four ASRAAM Block 6 to provide a dedicated fighter escort for P-8 Poseidon maritime patrol aircraft and E-7 Wedgetail AEW1 aircraft.

Basing

Altogether, the programme outlined in A Better Defence Estate, November 2016 and two announcements made since then will result in the disposal of up to fourteen airfields by 2030.

While the Strategic Approach for this rationalisation may have made sense in the world prior to Russia’s growing assertiveness, this is clearly no longer the case today. There are potentially militarily valuable airbases on the current disposal list that should be maintained at a minimum operational level. This could even mean that they are used commercially, but for purposes that do not harm their runways and buildings.

There are several criteria that could be used to assess the military value of these bases including the presence of hardened facilities such as Hardened Aircraft Shelters (HAS), a long runway of at least 2,500 metres and significant dispersal areas. This new criteria need not apply to bases in the South East where additional housing is most required.

The four airbases below are not situated on especially commercially valuable land and should not be sold.

1. MoD Woodbridge Airfield. Due to close in 2027 but has eighteen HAS and a 2,700 metre runway. The airfield was saved in 2019;

2. RAF Mildenhall. Currently a USAFE base due to close in 2024 with a 2,800 metre runway. USAFE decided to keep their base open in 2020;

3. RAF Scampton. Due to close in 2022 when the Red Arrows will have to be relocated but has a 2,700 metre runway and could become the home of the RAF Regiment, if it moved from RAF Honington;

4. RAF Wyton. Permission given for car storage up to 2028 but has a 2,500 metre runway.

As the MoD needs to reduce its running costs and maximise the proceeds it receives from selling land it should re-examine several airbases located in London and the South-East, particularly those with good transport links. Prime amongst these should be RAF Northolt. Located within the M25, next to the A40 with both mainline and underground rail services. This site could reach a premium price in the hands of the right developer.

Consideration should also be given to re-locating Air Command Headquarters from RAF High Wycombe to a geographically central, but cheaper, location such as RAF Shawbury or RAF Syerston.

Responding to Russia’s growing assertiveness three forward air bases are currently being operated from in Eastern Europe at Amari in Estonia, Siaulia in Lithuania and Mihail Kogalniceanu in Romania.

Conclusion

In total, there are fifteen proposals to be considered here as part of the Integrated Review, four+ of which have already been agreed since SDSR15.

Those that are essential include:
• ordering six F-35B a year from 2025 onwards
• joining the French-Italian Ballistic Missile Defence project and ordering 200 ground-launched Aster 30 Block 1NT
• integrating AMRAAM AIM-120D on to tranche 1 Typhoons (200 ordered July 2018)
• developing an Extended Range Storm Shadow under SPEAR 4 for tranche 2 and 3 Typhoons
• equipping Poseidon with 60 air-launched Harpoon II+ and 70 Mk 54 light torpedoes with HAAWC (as confirmed in a Parliamentary answer in May 2018)
• purchasing five E-7 Wedgetail AEW1 (ordered March 2019) and

• replacing remaining Hawk T1/1A with 32 Advanced Hawk.

Those that are desirable include:
• standing up tenth frontline Squadron
• enabling tranche 2 and 3 Typhoons to carry six Meteor A BVRAAM plus four ASRAAM Block 6 as their standard weapons mix in the QRA and air defence roles
• integrating Storm Shadow on the Poseidon and
• developing and ordering eight Sea Protector UCAV with sonobuoys and 30 Mk 54 light torpedoes with HAAWC.

And those that are optional include:
• maintaining and upgrading the Sentinel R2 Squadron
• integrating four ASRAAM Block 6 on the Hawk T2
• maintaining four additional airbases that have hardened facilities, long runways or significant dispersal areas (of which, MoD Woodbridge and RAF Mildenhall already announced to stay open) while developing RAF Northolt and RAF High Wycombe for housing and
• operating three forward air bases in Eastern Europe (Amari in Estonia, Siaulia in Lithuania and Mihail Kogalniceanu in Romania).

Air Command 2023-30 would operate:
• 42 F-35B Lightning II in 4 Squadrons to 84 in 6 Squadrons
• 139 Typhoons in 10 Squadrons to 115 in 8.5 Squadrons
• 10 Reaper UCAV in 2 Squadrons to be replaced by 16 Protector UCAV
• 9 P-8 Poseidon in 2 Squadrons
• 8 Sea Protector UCAV in 1 Squadron from 2025
• 3 E-3 Sentry AWACS in 1 Squadron to be replaced by 5 E-7 Wedgetail AEW1 from 2023
• 3 Air Seeker R1 in 1 Squadron
• 4 Sentinel R1/R2 in 1 Squadron
• 8 Shadow R1/R2 in 1 Squadron
• 200 ground-launched Aster 30 Block 1NT
• 500 Meteor B JNAAM from 2026
• 820 to 920 Meteor A BVRAAM
• 200 AMRAAM AIM-120D
• 300 AMRAAM AIM-120C5, OSD 2027
• 920 to 1,150 ASRAAM Block 6
• 400 Storm Shadow to be upgraded under SPEAR 4
• 2,040 SPEAR 3/-EW from 2025
• 1,600 to 1,360 Brimstone 3A
• 1,350 to 2,120 Brimstone 3B
• 400 Hellfire, OSD 2024
• 4,200 Paveway IV
• 60 air-launched Harpoon II+
• 70 to 100 Mk 54 light torpedoes with HAAWC
• 66 Hawk T1/1A in 3 Squadrons to 32 Advanced Hawk in 2.5 Squadrons
• 28 Hawk T2 in 2 Squadrons
• 14 Voyager KC2/3 in 2 Squadrons
• 8 C-17 Globemaster in 1 Squadron
• 22 Atlas C1 in 3 Squadrons and
• 14 Hercules C4 in 1 Squadron.

See Appendix 3a: Air Joint Force 2024 for details of combat aircraft based on SDSR15 together with the extra proposals contained here and how this changes in Appendix 3b: Air Joint Force 2032.

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Re: Air Command to 2030

Post by RetroSicotte »

I've actually wanted to see more "personal idea writeup posts" for a while, sometimes even contemplated a forum section for them.

Will pass further comment when I'm not just on a work break, but I think I've seen this one before on Think Defence? Or something similar? It's an intriguing read anyway, I'm sure some of the folks here will be happy to chatter about it!

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Re: Air Command to 2030

Post by AndyC »

Yes, some of the ideas first appeared in articles I wrote for Think Defence prior to the SDSR. In those I argued for the retention of the tranche 1 Typhoons and the need for an MPA - both of which have now happened. I also argued for the tranche 1's to get a basic AESA radar but having read more on the M-Scan I'm no longer convinced that's necessary.

In addition I said there was a case for an updated and armed Hawk and have expanded those views a bit - especially as the Hawk 1/1A OSD is 2020!

There is more information on aircraft orders and numbers than there was twelve months ago so this has all been included. I've also included the idea that 100 Squadron should operate both Typhoons and Hawks in the aggressor role.

What's definitely new is dividing my proposals into 'essential', 'desirable' and 'optional' to create some sort of priority listing. With the much publicised £178 billion ten year procurement budget both the essential and desirable options should be achievable. The optional items would then depend on maintaining the overall defence budget and controlling the larger cost items such as Trident Successor, F-35B and Type 26.

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Re: Air Command to 2030

Post by RetroSicotte »

We know the Captor-E won't work in th Tranche 1's, so I do wonder if the Raven ES-01 (A smaller, similar one for the Gripen with 1,200 t/r modules as opposed to 1,500 and the same field of traversable view) would though.

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Re: Air Command to 2030

Post by marktigger »

the concentration for F35 should be for their primary role as carrier aircraft.

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Re: Air Command to 2030

Post by AndyC »

RetroSicotte wrote:We know the Captor-E won't work in th Tranche 1's, so I do wonder if the Raven ES-01 (A smaller, similar one for the Gripen with 1,200 t/r modules as opposed to 1,500 and the same field of traversable view) would though.
Selex executive quoted in interview "during Flight Evaluation Trials several evaluating nations have already commented that Captor-M invariably detected targets at significantly greater ranges than RBE-2" so an upgrade to Raven or another basic AESA radar is not likely to be worth the cost.

I can recommend reading this informative article

https://hushkit.net/2015/06/06/the-eye- ... interview/

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Re: Air Command to 2030

Post by RetroSicotte »

There is a hell of a lot more to radars than just "range of detection", the advantages of an AESA over a Mechanical are quite literally far too numerous and complicated to type up in one post. Captor-M would still be effective, yes. But it has a bunch of drawbacks that will become particularly notable as we go forward. Predominantly low-emission, targeting of confused battlespace and precision of information.

It's worth noting that being greater than RBE-2 isn't exactly a massive achievement. RBE-2 is a tiny radar by comparison. Raven ES-01 is certainly not "basic", it's incredibly powerful, it only looks "basic" by comparison to the absolutely awesome specs of the Captor-E.

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Re: Air Command to 2030

Post by AndyC »

I guess it remains a judgement call.

If an upgrade to the Raven is possible without the costly fixes that are needed for Captor-E and if we're sure the tranche 1 aircraft are going to be around long enough then it might be worth it.

On the other hand if they're only going to be around to 2030 and if their peacetime role is all QRA, OCU and red aggressor while only more advanced Typhoons get deployed globally then maybe not.

For me the more compelling upgrade is from AMRAAM to Meteor (JNAAM version) as the missiles can start on the tranche 1's and then transition to the F-35B as they're introduced. I believe that offers far greater value for money.

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Re: Air Command to 2030

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AndyC wrote: concentrate on fleet air defence and anti-shipping, and mostly be carrier based
Hi Andy, a great post, will comment as I am reading through.

I agree with what you said leading to that, but how firm is the Spear 3 scheduling? F-35 (Bs!) will not have much anti-shipping capability w/o it; a good thing , though, that the MoD prioritised it over a "glide bomb" - not much use in anti-shipping, even though a very potent (and economical!) weapon in other uses.
AndyC wrote:able to match the performance of many more modern fixed plate smaller AESA radar
I agree with you, but do not mix up fixed plate (as in Rafale, for instance) with Raven (as in Gripen... and nowhere else, as far as I know).
AndyC wrote:should be equipped with Conformal Fuel Tanks to maximise their effective combat range, especially when carrying Storm Shadow missiles.
ohh, how many years on TD I was banging this drum... should go ahead, but the firmest news on it are the BAE wind tunnel trials?

... reading continues
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)

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Re: Air Command to 2030

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AndyC wrote:should include the Harpoon II + ER long-range anti-shipping missile
Is there such a thing? Indian P-8s have Harpoon; US a/c carry SLAM ER
AndyC wrote:Meteor BVRAAM (with a later B version known as the Joint New Air-to-Air Missile using an upgraded Japanese AESA seeker and designed to fit inside an F-35
But which F-35 version? They fly A (even though rumours about the desire for Bs for flat tops are rife)
AndyC wrote:SPEAR 3 will also be a very effective weapon against ship based radar and missile launchers which it could disable prior to the use of heavier anti-shipping missiles
By when do you think we will have any such (heavier)?
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)

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Re: Air Command to 2030

Post by AndyC »

SPEAR 3 seems to be on a steady development course now that it's seen off the SDB II.

You're right that a single SPEAR 3 won't sink anything very large but eight of them on one F-35B or 96 launched by a Squadron can overwhelm anti-missile defences then cripple ship based radar and launchers leaving them pretty defenceless against bigger anti-shipping missiles such as the Harpoon II + ER launched from Poseidon aircraft or from destroyers/frigates.

Harpoon II is already in service on the Poseidon and Boeing are developing the '+ ER' version for 2017 - so there's plenty of time to put it on our Poseidon's before they arrive in 2019. It could also be ordered as a replacement for our Harpoon I ship based missiles which have an OSD of 2018. So, hopefully, the MoD will be placing an order some time in the next twelve months for in service dates of 2018-19.

The alternative is Kongsberg's Nautical Strike Missile but I suspect the cost of integrating this on to the Poseidon might be prohibitive unless the US Navy goes for this option as well.

JNAAM is meant to fit all versions of the F-35.

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Re: Air Command to 2030

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The US State Department has given approval for the sale of up to 26 Protector UCAV see https://www.flightglobal.com/news/artic ... uk-431587/

The firm order of sixteen rather than the twenty announced in the SDSR 2015 may well reflect the 20% slump in the value of the Pound since the EU Referendum. The option for ten more probably depends on the successful development of a Sea Protector version. Good news that they'll be armed with British weapons, so increasing their capabilitiy and the prospect of sales to other countries.

I've updated the main article to reflect this development.

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Re: Air Command to 2030

Post by marktigger »

A return of an anti ship missile and Anti radiation missile would be useful. For the latter updating Alarm design and reintroducing on Typhoon and drones.

Hawk rebuild program for legacy hawks or even more 100 series to replace the T1A

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Re: Air Command to 2030

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We have to look at basics. I would rather have operational airframes than worry about what we hang on them. As long as they are cleared for kit and the Air and Ground crew have training with simulators and drill rounds, we can always buy stuff off allies or through UORs. Would people be willing to only get 7 P-8s or fewer F-35s by 2025 in order to buy some ornaments to hang off them.

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Re: Air Command to 2030

Post by LordJim »

AndyC, I assume you are talking about the Paveway IV and Brimstone on the protectors being more likely to be exported rather then the Protectors themselves.

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Re: Air Command to 2030

Post by AndyC »

Yes LordJim there is a considerable export potential if we ensure that Brimstone 2 is integrated on both the Protector and our new Apache helicopters as it is a much superior and longer ranged precision weapon than the US' Hellfire.

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Re: Air Command to 2030

Post by LordJim »

I agree and even the US military is/was interested but got no where due to political issues. I assume all integration costs will be paid by the UK as the US will want to continue exports of their Hellfire and SDB, and are more than happy to neuter the opposition.

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Re: Air Command to 2030

Post by cky7 »

marktigger wrote:A return of an anti ship missile and Anti radiation missile would be useful. For the latter updating Alarm design and reintroducing on Typhoon and drones
Agree. Dropping ALARM was a crazy decision. We really need our own EW capability. Would put us at the head of que on coalition ops.

Wasn't there talk along way back of an anti-radiation meteor? That should be investigated along with any upgrade paths/options (anglo Japanese AESA seeker etc) to maximise the world beating capability typhoon and meteor will offer.

I'd also like to see an order for MALD in all configurations.

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Re: Air Command to 2030

Post by bobp »

Mention of the ALARM missile, reminded of the US Phantom "Wild Weasel" back in the 1970's , and then the present day F18G "Growler". The Americans and also now the Australians see a need for suppression of enemy Air Defences despite also introducing the F35 into service. So there is a definite need for Electronic Attack alongside the possession of a Anti Radiation Missile.

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Re: Air Command to 2030

Post by cky7 »

I'd love the raf to have the next gen jamming pod but IIRC the usmc have dropped plans to add it to the f35 b so I doubt we'd pay to have it integrated alone :(

IIRC the great thing with the proposed meteor ARM was that it didn't need to be on a dedicated EW aircraft like ALARM.

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Re: Air Command to 2030

Post by bobp »

There was talk of an Electronic Attack Version of the F35 (Don't forget it has built in capabilities) and I believe its on the wish list for some in the USA. Here at home in the UK I cant see any of that happening due to lack of airplanes for one.

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Re: Air Command to 2030

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RetroSicotte wrote:I've actually wanted to see more "personal idea writeup posts" for a while, sometimes even contemplated a forum section for them.
I've thought about suggesting that in the past. I think its a nice idea to encourage discussion.
@LandSharkUK

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Re: Air Command to 2030

Post by shark bait »

cky7 wrote:Agree. Dropping ALARM was a crazy decision. We really need our own EW capability. Would put us at the head of que on coalition ops.
We do have EW our own EW capabilities, and control of the electronic domain is going to become increasingly challenging, so its important all branches of the forces are continuing to develop in this area. I am told it is one of our quieter capabilities because it is much easier to copy than traditional weapons.

Those EW capabilities will receive a boost when the F35 comes into service, which has competencies baked in from the start unlike any other platform to date. The RAF are confident the Spear + F35 will be much more capable of SEAD than Tornado + ALARM
AndyC wrote:Yes LordJim there is a considerable export potential if we ensure that Brimstone 2 is integrated on both the Protector and our new Apache helicopters as it is a much superior and longer ranged precision weapon than the US' Hellfire.
And its a shame we missed to opportunity to sell it to the Americans, if it had been done a couple of years back there a good chance the Americans would have adopted it, or a USA variant. However that time has passed and they're doubling down on Hellfire.

That being said there is still a market to grab outside the US.

I always wondered if our reluctance to integrate was because we would loose our direct access to USAF stocks, which are far superior to ours, which become stressed with anything more a light pick-up-truck bombing campaign.
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AndyC
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Re: Air Command to 2030

Post by AndyC »

It’s nearly two years since the 2015 SDSR and things have moved ahead in a mostly positive manner for Air Command. I am currently updating the main article and the attachments to reflect the changes that have been announced and their implications. Here is what we now know section by section:

F-35B Lightning II

• 14 aircraft will be in service by the end of the year with a further 21 on order. Everything is on course for the Lightning Force to reach 42 aircraft in 2023 based around two frontline Squadrons https://ukdefencejournal.org.uk/united- ... 35-128-go/

• Lightning Force Commander Harvey Smyth has briefed that the next objective is to grow numbers to 63 frontline aircraft (which implies a total of 84 F-35B altogether) based on four frontline Squadrons http://www.f-16.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=59&t=45896

• The UK is currently ordering F-35B’s at an average of seven per year (LRIP orders 13, 14 and 15). At this rate the 84th aircraft will be delivered at the end of 2029. However, there are growing cost pressures due to the declining value of the Pound. A reduction in the rate of buying new aircraft to six per year would see the 84th aircraft enter service at the end of 2030.

• There is mounting media speculation that the RAF are pushing hard for a ‘split buy’. The longer range of the F-35A might have some appeal once there are enough F-35B available for both QE carriers to operate together but this would not be desirable before then. If the 85th aircraft was an F-35A it would take until 2036 for the 138th aircraft to enter service if they are ordered at seven per year or 2039 if they are ordered at six per year.

indeid
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Re: Air Command to 2030

Post by indeid »

More importantly the RAF has regained the option of a punishment tour for naughty boys and girls.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news ... -k032r68d3

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