UK Defence Forum

Wildcat shows its teeth......
https://www.royalnavy.mod.uk/news-and-l ... rike-group

Lord Jim wrote:Does the Wildcat have flotation gear? Adding a folding rotor, powered or manual would also help when flying the platform out of area in a C-17 or Atlas. If the AW149 is in line to be operated by the SF and the SFSG then having it marinized, or at least some of them, makes sense. I wonder if an AW149 could carry four Sea Venom?

Yes
Yes, would probably also need a folding tail
Yes, and apparently not much would need regarding salt water corrosion resistance. J Tatersall in a comment above listed most of the other needs. Not technically difficult but does eat into payload and would take time & money to develop and test.
Yes, well within load limits. Brimstone has also been shown attached previously ...

Ron5 wrote: ↑25 Oct 2021, 11:30

Lord Jim wrote:Does the Wildcat have flotation gear? Adding a folding rotor, powered or manual would also help when flying the platform out of area in a C-17 or Atlas. If the AW149 is in line to be operated by the SF and the SFSG then having it marinized, or at least some of them, makes sense. I wonder if an AW149 could carry four Sea Venom?

Yes
Yes, would probably also need a folding tail
Yes, and apparently not much would need regarding salt water corrosion resistance. J Tatersall in a comment above listed most of the other needs. Not technically difficult but does eat into payload and would take time & money to develop and test.
Yes, well within load limits. Brimstone has also been shown attached previously ...

Being able to use Brimstone or the same weapon as is being purchased for the Apache Guardians would be very useful covering both land and sea targets if needed. Yes it would eat into payload but I am sure there will be times where that will both be acceptable and necessary.

Ron5 wrote: ↑25 Oct 2021, 11:30
Yes, would probably also need a folding tail
Yes, and apparently not much would need regarding salt water corrosion resistance. J Tatersall in a comment above listed most of the other needs. Not technically difficult but does eat into payload and would take time & money to develop and test.
Yes, well within load limits. Brimstone has also been shown attached previously ...

Apologies, I'm a bit late to the party! However was having similar thoughts earlier about eventually replacing the Wildcat fleet with NMH,

I think AW149 could, like Wildcat, get away with lacking a folding tail. Thanks to the RN having Merlin sized hangars.

Folded Merlin is 15.75m long, with another metre roughly for access to the radar.

AW149 should be roughly equivalent, or shorter than that, if fitted with a folding main rotor. I presume Leonardo have adequate experience integrating such onto an otherwise mature platform.



Speculation: Quite a chunky bird around the waist, the AW149, but you might just squeeze two of them into a hangar that could take two Wildcats (3.05m wide without the weapons wing).

At present, the largest AW149 user is the Egyptian Navy, though I'm unsure if they asked Leonardo for any specific further marinisation. Also not sure if they're shore based or on their Mistral-ski class...

I am of the opinion the whatever is selected for the NMH, should be allocated to the AAC. They would then be able to form two Regiments, which would also provide the detachments in Brunei and Cyprus and one Squadron could be dedicated to support of SF. The remainder would be available if not permanently part of 16 AA. The AAC Wildcats should be retained as well as they are starting to prove themselves as very good scouts for the Apaches, and possible future upgrades should make them even more so.

Jensy wrote: ↑20 Dec 2021, 01:22 Apologies, I'm a bit late to the party! However was having similar thoughts earlier about eventually replacing the Wildcat fleet with NMH,

To be honest we should never have built Wildcat in the first place. AW139 was available years before, and AW149 at the same time, and addressed all of Lynx's shortcomings (limited cabin and lifting capacity). A powered blade fold would be comparatively straightforward for AW and even a limited tail fold of just the empennage would have been really beneficial, not just for shipboard use, but air transport.

Main Blade folding I can see for boats but can’t see why you would want to add the complexity or weight to fold the tail on the aw series.

They usually take the blades off anyway for air transport.

Timmymagic wrote: ↑20 Dec 2021, 10:50

Jensy wrote: ↑20 Dec 2021, 01:22 Apologies, I'm a bit late to the party! However was having similar thoughts earlier about eventually replacing the Wildcat fleet with NMH,

To be honest we should never have built Wildcat in the first place. AW139 was available years before, and AW149 at the same time, and addressed all of Lynx's shortcomings (limited cabin and lifting capacity). A powered blade fold would be comparatively straightforward for AW and even a limited tail fold of just the empennage would have been really beneficial, not just for shipboard use, but air transport.

To be honest, I would agree, Wildcat was a hugely expensive helicopter to develop, an excellent small Naval machine, but forced on the Army, who still scratch their heads looking for something for it to do...

I don't buy the scouting role as it has no dedicated scouting sensors apart from a flir, no mast sight, no significant elint equipment or locating electronics.

If by scouting you mean buzz about the front line and get shot down, then I suppose it's a scout helicopter....

The only way it will survive in a modern war is flying flat out at tree top level, where it won't see a bloody thing!

An utter vanity project, hugely expensive, purely built to keep Wastelands open, with only a handful of exports...

We should have just bought SH60R's for the RN and Blackhawk for the RAF and Army.

If "Tarzan" hadn't stirred it up we would have been making blackhawks at Yeovilton so we could replace like with like.

I thought he was involved in the '101? Was he still around for Wildcat???

Sorry, my bad, I think you are correct. But had we just had Blackhawks instead of 101 & Lynx (and now puma), would that have been a better option?

Great news for Yeovil, though AW159 is not exactly selling like its predecessor.

SKB wrote: ↑12 Jun 2023, 17:00

Have we sent the video to the Islamic Revolutionary Guard so they know what their up against otherwise a bit of a waste of money is it not.

tomuk wrote: ↑12 Jun 2023, 17:19

SKB wrote: ↑12 Jun 2023, 17:00

Have we sent the video to the Islamic Revolutionary Guard so they know what their up against otherwise a bit of a waste of money is it not.

I think they're confident in the drones that we helped them build 🫤.

new guy wrote: ↑12 Jun 2023, 17:30

tomuk wrote: ↑12 Jun 2023, 17:19

SKB wrote: ↑12 Jun 2023, 17:00

Have we sent the video to the Islamic Revolutionary Guard so they know what their up against otherwise a bit of a waste of money is it not.

I think they're confident in the drones that we helped them build 🫤.

Yes I wonder what we have taught the Chinese too.

Apparently yeovil just resumed AW159 production for an unnamed customer.

https://mil.in.ua/uk/news/brytanska-kom ... ikopteriv/

Warton (BAE) just resumed production of the AW159 Wildcat !!!!!

Wrong part of the Country (Not Lancashire)
Wrong Company (Not BAE)

Try Yeovil, Somerset and Leonardo (Augusta Westland) and you just might be correct !

Very interesting. How many and for whom....hopefully, we'll find out soon

dmereifield wrote: ↑26 Aug 2023, 07:20 Very interesting. How many and for whom....hopefully, we'll find out soon

3

And its for a North African country, either Algeria or Morocco.

It's been known about for some time.

Shame, was hoping it was a larger order

dmereifield wrote: ↑26 Aug 2023, 12:12 Shame, was hoping it was a larger order

I'm afraid not, the lingering death of Wildcat keeps grinding excruciatingly onwards....

mrclark303 wrote: ↑26 Aug 2023, 14:14

dmereifield wrote: ↑26 Aug 2023, 12:12 Shame, was hoping it was a larger order

I'm afraid not, the lingering death of Wildcat keeps grinding excruciatingly onwards....

You sound disapointed. It is if you think it is a shame that another country did not see the light (in your view) of buying expensive US alternative imports.....

I for one am glad that British based employees get to work even if it is just another 24 helicopters, and thereby keep their skills fresh and up to date. We have underinvested in our UK based Defence industry in general for years, allowing too many companies to be purchased by foriegn competitors, and often for the British factories being closed and the work shifted to overseas, cheaper workforce.

The combination of Covid and the Russian invasion of Ukraine has shown the importance of having local, secure, resilient supply chains, and not relying on cheaper overseas production, over which we have no control. So for me every bit of British based Defence production is a small step in the right direction.

At the end of the day the Wildcat comes from a UK specification for an Anti-Surface warfare naval helicopter. Not sure there's anything out there to match it when it comes to countering swarms of fast attack craft which is what its designed for. It can also support ASW operations and anti-piracy work.