AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

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Timmymagic
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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Post by Timmymagic »

bobp wrote:The wildcat will still be able to use its door mounted guns according to the Janes article.
Look how limited the traverse would be though.

Ron5
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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Post by Ron5 »

More including a Crowsnest update ..

https://aviationweek.com/special-topics ... fb53b52134

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

A good find, especially the anti-surface dimension. FACs have not gotten any bigger, but their weapon delivery ranges have been extended (hence the corvette mention might mean that a Wildcat screen on its own will be insufficient).

Also a whiff of a mini-Nimrod debacle:
"Crowsnest, led by prime contractor Lockheed Martin, has been challenged by “three different integration problems in one,” senior Royal Navy officers told a conference in London in February.

“We were taking a system that had some original parts; others needed a firmware upgrade; and some have needed replacing entirely because of obsolescence,” one officer said. “It has been a tough ride"
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RichardIC
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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Post by RichardIC »

bobp wrote:The wildcat will still be able to use its door mounted guns according to the Janes article.
It doesn’t say the missile wing and the door gun can be carried simultaneously.

https://www.janes.com/article/94747/wil ... g-unveiled

bobp
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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Post by bobp »

True nor can I see how a door mounted gun could function. This is the extract from Janes.....

The Sea Venom is not to formally enter service with the RN until January 2022, so the Wildcat will only be equipped with Martlet missiles and door guns, as well as BAE Stingray anti-submarine torpedoes and Mark 11 depth charges, during CSG21.

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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Post by Ron5 »

Timmymagic wrote:Don't think the pintle mounted M3M will fit with the wings attached
Is that different with the current weapons carrier? I don't remember ever seeing the gun and the carrier fitted at the same time.

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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Post by Ron5 »

Ron5 wrote:
Timmymagic wrote:Don't think the pintle mounted M3M will fit with the wings attached
Is that different with the current weapons carrier? I don't remember ever seeing the gun and the carrier fitted at the same time.
I think it's a case of one or the other ..

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SKB
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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

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J. Tattersall

Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Post by J. Tattersall »

https://www.janes.com/article/94747/wil ... g-unveiled

Seem to recall from periodicals of the time that Westland looked into wings on a helicopter a few decades ago, before Wildcat was even thought of. I expect there's a slight overall aerodynamic advantage, but the big plus is probably commonality of the weapons carriers and hard points allowing logistics benefits and reduced turnaround times for the aircraft on deck.

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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Post by Dahedd »

J. Tattersall wrote:https://www.janes.com/article/94747/wil ... g-unveiled

Seem to recall from periodicals of the time that Westland looked into wings on a helicopter a few decades ago, before Wildcat was even thought of. I expect there's a slight overall aerodynamic advantage, but the big plus is probably commonality of the weapons carriers and hard points allowing logistics benefits and reduced turnaround times for the aircraft on deck.
I seem to remember an old concept pic of a Merlin with wings coming from the upper cabin just below the engines. Iirc the article spoke of enhanced speed, lift & better fuel efficiency.

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

Dahedd wrote:Iirc the article spoke of enhanced speed, lift & better fuel efficiency.
The two navy helos being different in one being for ASW (only?) and the other should have more (!) ASuW options to make up for the v high unit price that was paid upfront
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Lord Jim
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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Post by Lord Jim »

Wasn't the Merlin with "Wings" a possible design to counter the size of Radar possibly to be used in the AEW role and also to increase its altitude and range to make it more effective?

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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Post by Timmymagic »

It's being reported that Wildcat has fired Martlet for the first time from the Wildcat weapons wing, at a boat target off Wales (presumably Aberporth Firing Range).

Intriguingly its being reported that the missile used SAL AND Infrared...hopefully this isn't a press release mistake referring to the Wildcats E/O sensors and is referring to the seeker. If it is the seeker that is really big news as we've all been assuming SAL only initially. If its SAL and IIR its a massive increase in capability.



V. good picture thread in the below tweet thread, mentions that the RN and RM are still investigating cannon and 'heavy' weapons, which could mean Brimstone, CRV7 (or maybe even APKWS like the Apache fleet are looking at?). Cannon would presumably be the M230. I would like to see MG mounts on the tips of the wings, just GPMG would do, nothing ambitious or heavy like minigun, M3M or .338 guns.


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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

Lord Jim wrote: to increase its altitude and range to make it more effective?
Osprey was seriously in the running, so yes, those were the numbers that needed to be bettered
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)

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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Post by SW1 »

Got to remember that while wings help in one part of the flight regime they will detract in others. Good for fwd flight extra weight in the hover.

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

SW1 wrote: Good for fwd flight extra weight in the hover.
ASW certainly involves quite a bit of hover, but is that the case for doing AEW duties?
- now with a mainly ASW fleet that can be tasked (roll-on & off with kit) for AEW, perhaps not a surprise that the wings were 'clipped'?

Wildcats not doing much of either, so the wing is for increasing the ASuW loadout (to increase the numbers that can be 'hung') rather than anything else? Just an educated guess
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)

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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Post by SW1 »

ArmChairCivvy wrote:
SW1 wrote: Good for fwd flight extra weight in the hover.
ASW certainly involves quite a bit of hover, but is that the case for doing AEW duties?
- now with a mainly ASW fleet that can be tasked (roll-on & off with kit) for AEW, perhaps not a surprise that the wings were 'clipped'?

Wildcats not doing much of either, so the wing is for increasing the ASuW loadout (to increase the numbers that can be 'hung') rather than anything else? Just an educated guess
They need to land and takeoff too. It’s all a balance.

I would of thought that was likely the main reason, any benefits in cruise a bonus.

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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Post by Dahedd »

Lord Jim wrote:Wasn't the Merlin with "Wings" a possible design to counter the size of Radar possibly to be used in the AEW role and also to increase its altitude and range to make it more effective?
I've looked online & couldbt find any pics of it though.

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

Dahedd wrote:I've looked online & couldbt find any pics of it though.
TD archives; don't know if the search function works any better now than during the time the pieces were available online, though
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)

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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Post by Ron5 »

Wings were reputed to have been those of the Hawker Hurricane ..

Image

A bonus from the same place ..

Image

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whitelancer
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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Post by whitelancer »

I know the Lynx held the speed record for a helicopter, but wouldn't have thought it needed swept wings! :eh:

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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Post by donald_of_tokyo »

Impressive... from ""
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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Post by Ron5 »

Superb set of photos, thank you Donald-san.

Timmymagic
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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Post by Timmymagic »

Didn't really appreciate the wing cant until I saw this image. It doesn't look like you could even use a GPMG mount effectively given the space the wing occupies, certainly not an M3M.

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RichardIC
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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Post by RichardIC »

https://www.leonardocompany.com/en/pres ... ssile-lmm-

So it looks like Wildcat is going to form part of the QLZ's airgroup when she deploys next year.

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