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Re: Type 45 Destroyer (Daring Class) (RN) [News Only]

Posted: 27 Oct 2021, 19:08
by ETH
Haha, my bad :D

Re: Type 45 Destroyer (Daring Class) (RN) [News Only]

Posted: 28 Oct 2021, 02:33
by tomuk
ETH wrote:HMS Montrose had a new Artisan system installed out in Bahrain.
Reading the RN press release it appears they took it off to replace the rotator and put the same Artisan back on.

Re: Type 45 Destroyer (Daring Class) (RN) [News Only]

Posted: 02 Nov 2021, 09:51
by SKB

Re: Type 45 Destroyer (Daring Class) (RN) [News Only]

Posted: 17 Nov 2021, 00:03
by tomuk
Type 45 destroyer HMS Defender fitted with new ARM (Angry Royal Marine) missiles.
Image

@NavyLookout https://twitter.com/NavyLookout/status/ ... 9161681921

Re: Type 45 Destroyer (Daring Class) (RN) [News Only]

Posted: 17 Nov 2021, 02:26
by Scimitar54
Slightly wrong! It is the Army that is a projectile (missile) to be fired by the Navy. The Navy of course includes the Royal Marines. :mrgreen:

Re: Type 45 Destroyer (Daring Class) (RN) [News Only]

Posted: 17 Nov 2021, 11:58
by NickC
FWIW recently came across range of Aster 15 (310kg) & 30 (450kg) missiles quoted by Norman Friedman 2005 Naval Institute Guide to World Naval Weapon Systems - 5th Edition

Aster 15
Max range (non-performing targets) 30 km /16 nm
Range against subsonic sea skimmers or supersonic fighters 1.7 to 17 km / 1 nm to 9 nm
Range against supersonic sea skimmers 1.7 to 12 km / 1 nm to 6.5 nm

Aster 30
Max range (non-performing targets) 120 km / 65nm
Range against subsonic sea skimmers or supersonic fighters 3 to 50 km / 1.6 nm to 27 nm
Range against supersonic sea skimmers 3 to 35 km / 1.6 nm to 19 nm

Have seen claims the new variant Aster 30 Block 1NT contracted for future fit to the T45 extends max range by 25% to 150 km/ 80 nm and presume similar percentage increases in range for performing subsonic and supersonic targets.

PS Of interest Sea Ceptor at only one third of the weight of a Aster 15 claims max range of 25 km, 80+% of an Aster 15, how is that possible?
MBDA claims Sea Ceptor soft launch enables ~30% more range as opposed to missiles rockets fired live from their VLS cells, the rocket motors usually burn out after only ~ 7 to 10 seconds so a much higher percentage of their energy used on launch and turn over.

Re: Type 45 Destroyer (Daring Class) (RN) [News Only]

Posted: 17 Nov 2021, 17:43
by SKB
Is there an Aster IX?
Image Gotcha. :mrgreen:

Re: Type 45 Destroyer (Daring Class) (RN) [News Only]

Posted: 17 Nov 2021, 20:46
by ETH
NickC wrote:Have seen claims the new variant Aster 30 Block 1NT contracted for future fit to the T45 extends max range by 25% to 150 km/ 80 nm and presume similar percentage increases in range for performing subsonic and supersonic targets.
FWIW that only stems from new lofted flight profiles so you won't get an equivalent range/energy increase at low altitude intercepts.
NickC wrote:PS Of interest Sea Ceptor at only one third of the weight of a Aster 15 claims max range of 25 km, 80+% of an Aster 15, how is that possible?
MBDA claims Sea Ceptor soft launch enables ~30% more range as opposed to missiles rockets fired live from their VLS cells, the rocket motors usually burn out after only ~ 7 to 10 seconds so a much higher percentage of their energy used on launch and turn over.
Aster 15 as a system is much less efficient than Aster 30 or CAMM. A lot of A15's mass goes to A30 sized parts, designed to fit an A30 sized booster. A15 was developed after A30 and used the same sustain motor but a far smaller booster which is near used up once it leaves the ship.

Re: Type 45 Destroyer (Daring Class) (RN) [News Only]

Posted: 19 Nov 2021, 10:25
by NickC
ETH wrote: 17 Nov 2021, 20:46
NickC wrote:Have seen claims the new variant Aster 30 Block 1NT contracted for future fit to the T45 extends max range by 25% to 150 km/ 80 nm and presume similar percentage increases in range for performing subsonic and supersonic targets.
FWIW that only stems from new lofted flight profiles so you won't get an equivalent range/energy increase at low altitude intercepts.
Thx for your input, had wondered if using new gen higher energetic propellant, Americans looking at CL-20 though understand its nasty stuff.

Re: Type 45 Destroyer (Daring Class) (RN) [News Only]

Posted: 09 Dec 2021, 10:33
by SKB

...to Portsmouth

and...

Re: Type 45 Destroyer (Daring Class) (RN) [News Only]

Posted: 09 Dec 2021, 17:08
by SKB


Re: Type 45 Destroyer (Daring Class) (RN) [News Only]

Posted: 20 Jan 2022, 18:52
by Jdam


‘later this year' taking there time :wtf:

Re: Type 45 Destroyer (Daring Class) (RN) [News Only]

Posted: 26 Jan 2022, 08:57
by jonas

Re: Type 45 Destroyer (Daring Class) (RN) [News Only]

Posted: 08 Feb 2022, 19:43
by wargame_insomniac
"HMS Dragon was pictured entering Portsmouth on Monday, joining HMS Defender, Diamond, and Duncan alongside.

HMS Dauntless and Daring are docked in Birkenhead, receiving modification as part of the PIP.

It is understood that HMS Defender and Diamond are "at notice to sail", but remain alongside."

https://www.forces.net/news/all-six-roy ... ons-russia


It is worrying that as tensions in South China Sea and especially Ukraine escalate, that we are so short on escorts able to provide area AAW defence. Hopefully HMS Dauntless should be back to sea soon after completing PIP.

Re: Type 45 Destroyer (Daring Class) (RN) [News Only]

Posted: 09 Feb 2022, 09:14
by Tempest414
wargame_insomniac wrote: 08 Feb 2022, 19:43 "HMS Dragon was pictured entering Portsmouth on Monday, joining HMS Defender, Diamond, and Duncan alongside.

HMS Dauntless and Daring are docked in Birkenhead, receiving modification as part of the PIP.

It is understood that HMS Defender and Diamond are "at notice to sail", but remain alongside."

https://www.forces.net/news/all-six-roy ... ons-russia


It is worrying that as tensions in South China Sea and especially Ukraine escalate, that we are so short on escorts able to provide area AAW defence. Hopefully HMS Dauntless should be back to sea soon after completing PIP.
They right where they need to be both carriers are in port so the Type 45's should be in port as well we don't have enough for them to paddle around without a carrier to escort

Re: Type 45 Destroyer (Daring Class) (RN) [News Only]

Posted: 09 Feb 2022, 13:00
by SW1
Must be nearly 6 years since dauntless or daring sailed on operations.

Type 45 seem to spend they time tied up no matter if the carriers are there are not.

Re: Type 45 Destroyer (Daring Class) (RN) [News Only]

Posted: 09 Feb 2022, 22:45
by tomuk
Easy way to 12 AAW destroyers. T83 will have to be built to keep BAE busy. T45 will stay in service as they were mainly alongside during their early years.

Re: Type 45 Destroyer (Daring Class) (RN) [News Only]

Posted: 09 Feb 2022, 22:51
by Jdam
Still got to go in for their sea ceptor upgrade, no doubt another 12 months out the water for that.

Re: Type 45 Destroyer (Daring Class) (RN) [News Only]

Posted: 10 Feb 2022, 06:24
by Cooper
When their time is done, these T-45s will be looked back on as a complete lemons, IMO.

..they will have spent far too much time in dry dock having their defects corrected, to be regarded as anything but.

Even if they have all their problems fixed, by the time the last one is in the water in a fit and proper state, they will probably only see less than another 5-10yrs service.

Re: Type 45 Destroyer (Daring Class) (RN) [News Only]

Posted: 10 Feb 2022, 10:33
by Jdam


I wonder how long we can keep this going for.

Re: Type 45 Destroyer (Daring Class) (RN) [News Only]

Posted: 10 Feb 2022, 10:39
by Tempest414
SW1 wrote: 09 Feb 2022, 13:00 Must be nearly 6 years since dauntless or daring sailed on operations.

Type 45 seem to spend they time tied up no matter if the carriers are there are not.
I would agree in part however over the last few years 3 Type 45 have been sea going 1 laid up and two in maintenance

Now with the carriers the focus had changed to carrier escort being there only task

Re: Type 45 Destroyer (Daring Class) (RN) [News Only]

Posted: 10 Feb 2022, 11:00
by Cooper
Jdam wrote: 10 Feb 2022, 10:33

I wonder how long we can keep this going for.
Great, the most unreliable ship in CSG 21 is being sent back out to sea already... :crazy:

Re: Type 45 Destroyer (Daring Class) (RN) [News Only]

Posted: 10 Feb 2022, 14:00
by tomuk
Cooper wrote: 10 Feb 2022, 11:00 Great, the most unreliable ship in CSG 21 is being sent back out to sea already... :crazy:
You mean the only T45 that has had a major repair, new WR21? and then gone a short shakedown cruise to Singapore and back. Tip Top condition I'd say.

Re: Type 45 Destroyer (Daring Class) (RN) [News Only]

Posted: 10 Feb 2022, 15:51
by Tempest414
bad move should be readied for carrier escort of POW not padding off to the Black Sea

Re: Type 45 Destroyer (Daring Class) (RN) [News Only]

Posted: 10 Feb 2022, 18:26
by Scimitar54
The folly of having so few surface combatants in general and T45s in particular. :mrgreen: