BAE Hawk (RAF & RN)

Contains threads on Joint Service equipment of the past, present and future.
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Gabriele
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Re: BAE Hawk

Post by Gabriele »

Italy is offering them the M-346, either for use in Kuwait or in Galatina, where the italian training takes place. Italy has a well known ambition to turn Galatina into a major multinational training centre with a large M-346 fleet. The M-346 was originally born when the "eurotrainer" project was a thing and there was this idea of centralizing fast jet pilots training at european level, and Alenia has not quite given up on that dream.
Kuwait, among with several other countries, has a presence at Galatina already.
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ThunderPants
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Re: BAE Hawk

Post by ThunderPants »

Funny that i could not help but comment, was in Galatina last year October to December, 2016 for avionic support on the M-346. When I was there they had 7 airframes and 2 new ones arrived the day I left. I personally think the aircraft is just to complicated for effective use as a trainer aircraft and they have major problems with the tail plane mechanism as it was failing the backlash tests every time. And funny enough I also worked at Al Salam airbase Kuwait from 2002 to 2005 but on Tucanos not the Hawk, although did 7 years at Valley on on hawk Mk 1's and a year at warton on the LiFT project, and Indian/Australian hawk demonstrators.

Funny thing about Galatina airbase, everyone uses the same mess, NCO's Senior NCO's and officers. I did have the privilege of sitting at the Station commanders table, although I was not invited? oh yeah and everyone in the air force seems to be a Sgt or above?

Timmymagic
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Re: BAE Hawk

Post by Timmymagic »

marktigger wrote:there is a good market round the world for hawk type aircraft especially if it can use modern weapons.
Didn't we think that with the Hawk 200? It was an excellent aircraft, but got surprisingly little traction. It's a pity they don't revisit it, there was talk that an RB.199 could be fitted in place of the Adour, with the modern wing and a little extra internal fuel in some conformals it would be a very nippy little strike aircraft. Sort of thing that even New Zealand could stump up the cash for.

Lord Jim
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Re: BAE Hawk

Post by Lord Jim »

How does the price of the current Hawk being offered compare to the M-346? The Current Hawk 100 series are very good but is it too good and costly for the role of advanced trainer? As for light attack, that seems to have gone down the road of Turboprops with countries prepared to pay extra for Second hand multirole 3rd Gen fast Jets as an alternative. In addition you have the South Korean T/A-50 on the market which is pretty much cleaning up the far east F-5 replacement market and so on.

In my mind BAe/SAAB should have pushed the JAS-39 Gripen far harder as it was/is a real alternative to the F-16 but I have always felt BAe preferred to push the Typhoon as a priority, losing out the US and Russian planes mainly on cost grounds.

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SKB
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Re: BAE Hawk

Post by SKB »




Red Arrows aircraft (BAE Hawk) crashes at RAF Valley on Anglesey, Wales.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-nort ... s-43476222



^ Also posted in Red Arrows thread: https://www.ukdefenceforum.net/viewtopi ... 186#p64186

Aethulwulf
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Re: BAE Hawk

Post by Aethulwulf »

The RAF is going to stand up 25 (F) Squadron to operate the Hawk T2 advanced jet trainer, alongside 4 Sqn as its second training unit at RAF Valley.

This move has been prompted by an increased demand for fast jet pilots for Typhon and F35b.

dmereifield
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Re: BAE Hawk

Post by dmereifield »

Aethulwulf wrote:The RAF is going to stand up 25 (F) Squadron to operate the Hawk T2 advanced jet trainer, alongside 4 Sqn as its second training unit at RAF Valley.

This move has been prompted by an increased demand for fast jet pilots for Typhon and F35b.
How many aircraft are allocated to each squadron?

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SKB
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Re: BAE Hawk

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dmereifield
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Re: BAE Hawk

Post by dmereifield »

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/qata ... nto-action

Sale of 9 Hawks (and 24 Typhoons) to Qatar confirmed...

bobp
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Re: BAE Hawk

Post by bobp »

It appears the RAF are using Hawk T1 variants for training due to a surge in need for trained pilots.

https://www.janes.com/article/85879/raf ... on-hawk-t1

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SKB
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Re: BAE Hawk

Post by SKB »

World's oldest Hawk goes into museum.


(Forces TV) 5th September 2019
For what is thought to be the first time EVER, a Chinook has airlifted a vintage Hawk jet. Several Chinook personnel who were involved in the recent Whaley Bridge Dam crisis, airlifted the Hawk at Boscombe Down and headed towards Old Sarum Airfield. The XX154 was a pre-production Hawk model and will now be on display at the Boscombe Down museum.

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SKB
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Re: BAE Hawk

Post by SKB »


(Forces TV) 6th April 2020
RAF Cosford has welcomed some more aircraft into its engineering school. In total, the base has been gifted five Hawk aircraft, including this one which was transported in three pieces from RAF Shawbury last month.

bobp
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Re: BAE Hawk

Post by bobp »

Getting ready for exercise...........


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Jensy
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Re: BAE Hawk

Post by Jensy »

bobp wrote:Getting ready for exercise...........

That lightning bolt on the tail new?

Really like how we've developed a 'lightning force' brand. Our F-35s were looking a bit too minimalist before!

Ron5
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Re: BAE Hawk

Post by Ron5 »

Gonna have to report you guys for talking about a Navy aircraft in a RAF forum. Shame on you.

bobp
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Re: BAE Hawk

Post by bobp »

Ron5 wrote:Gonna have to report you guys for talking about a Navy aircraft in a RAF forum. Shame on you.
Shhhhh!!!

SW1
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Re: BAE Hawk

Post by SW1 »

'Pride' as military aircraft factory ends production
After 104 years, today marks the end of manufacturing at a military aircraft factory in East Yorkshire.

Exterior of the factory
BBCCopyright: BBC
BAE Systems says it's the end of an era as its plant in Brough finishes production of Hawk jets, with only one final delivery to Qatar.

In October 2017, BAE announced almost 400 job losses at the site.

More than 200 staff have since taken voluntary redundancy, and more than 100 are moving to other BAE sites.

Dave Corfield, site manager for BAE Systems at Brough says: "It's an emotional day and a sad day as well.

"I've been at the plant now for 42 years, so it's sad to see it go, but we will reach that end point with real pride."

From January, there will be about 650 people employed at the site with the focus on engineering, rather than manufacturing.

bobp
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Re: BAE Hawk

Post by bobp »

SW1 wrote:'Pride' as military aircraft factory ends production
Yes I served an apprenticeship there from 1965-1970, worked on Buccaneers before ending up in the electrical test department. So sad day for me also. My Dad worked in the Drawing office there for 25 years.

Lord Jim
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Re: BAE Hawk

Post by Lord Jim »

Things are going to get interesting when the Red Arrows are finally allowed to have a new ride!

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: BAE Hawk

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

Lord Jim wrote:the Red Arrows' a new ride!
Tiffie Tr1s?
- they make more noise, too :thumbup:
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bobp
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Re: BAE Hawk

Post by bobp »

ArmChairCivvy wrote:Tiffie Tr1s?
Cost per flight hour would probably rule that out. But would possibly attract future sales maybe.

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: BAE Hawk

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

I know; was just thinking of e.g. the Blue Angels who tend to fly fighter grade, and often the oldest, aircraft
- there is a Hawk line in India (though I thought that it used a lot of UK-made parts)
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)

bobp
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Re: BAE Hawk

Post by bobp »

ArmChairCivvy wrote:there is a Hawk line in India
Also there was T45 productio9n in the US.

Not sure what parts, if any, that are made in the UK to support the worldwide fleet. Which is slowly shrinking as the fleet ages. Shame no successor has been designed and manufactured.

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Jensy
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Re: BAE Hawk

Post by Jensy »

bobp wrote:
ArmChairCivvy wrote:there is a Hawk line in India
Also there was T45 productio9n in the US.

Not sure what parts, if any, that are made in the UK to support the worldwide fleet. Which is slowly shrinking as the fleet ages. Shame no successor has been designed and manufactured.
I might be a few years our of date, but believe the Hawk production line was effectively relocated to Samelsbury where they still (at least partially) build aircraft in kit form for Saudi, which are then assembled locally (no actually manufacturing takes place there). Since they built the F-35 aerostructure facility and covered the runway with solar panels, the runways are inoperable.

Whether there is currently any form of a final assembly line in the UK (would presumably be Warton), now that the Qatari order is wrapping up, I'm not certain.

Despite a crowded marketplace, there are still strong industrial arguments for a British-built Hawk replacement, even if it's an adaption or derivative of an existing aircraft. Huge growth markets in many regions we have strong bilateral links.

Brough however is a deeply sad loss. Home to some of the UK's most inconic and enduring military aircraft, plus a world class design capability, even after rationalisation of the sector. Another resurrection of the site by BAE would be welcome, though seemingly unlikely as I think the housing developers are already moving in.

bobp
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Re: BAE Hawk

Post by bobp »

SW1 wrote:From January, there will be about 650 people employed at the site with the focus on engineering, rather than manufacturing.
When I worked there, over 5000 jobs were available. Some of the buildings are now occupied by other companies, so there is work going on at the site. It sounds like Bae have kept the machine shop going making parts for its other factories such as Warton.

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