Australian Defence Force

[NickC]

BAE Australia issues PR to counter all the bad press Hunter has been receiving

BAE Systems Publishes Status Report on Australia's Hunter-class Frigate Program
Hunter Class Frigates: November 2023 Update - Nov. 01, 2023

https://www.defense-aerospace.com/bae-s ... e-program/

[Mercator]

another contender:
https://x.com/2805662/status/1720162721306730908?s=20

[Mercator]

https://x.com/DTRmag/status/1720015643259613508?s=20
DTR mag:
The Whiskey Project Group and Rafael have linked arms on the development of the Whiskey Bravo - Strike small combatant craft armed with Spike NLOS.

[Mercator]

Some interesting proposals at this years Indo Pacific trade show (via the indispensable Twitter feed of Gregory Knowles):
https://twitter.com/2805662

Navantia Hobart class evolution:


And their corvette offering:


the accompanying graphics
https://x.com/sweeneygov/status/1721704 ... 48391?s=20
https://x.com/sweeneygov/status/1721703 ... 44064?s=20

[Mercator]

this tweet from Tim Fish is worth a look too:
https://x.com/sweeneygov/status/1721700 ... 91048?s=20

A new Guided Missile variant of the @Australian_Navy
#Hunter-class #frigate from @BAESystemsAus
with up to 96 missile cells available by replacing the modular mission payload bay with a 64-cell unit.

[sol]

[SKB]

^ Enlarged images

[NickC]

IF the Australians cancel the Hunter which looks a possibility, with the recent precedent set by the Sept 2021 cancellation of the multi-billion deal for the 12 French submarines to be replaced by AUKUS, would think by far the strongest favourite to replace the Hunter would be the US Navy (Fincantieri) Constellation class frigate, currently it seems Australians are on a buying spree of US military hardware.

[SiVisPacemParaBellum]

tkMS's pitch towards a Tier 2 Combatant/partial Hunter replacement.
Reportedly called Meko-A210 - based on Meko-A400 which doesn't make any sense.
Features 64 MK41 VLS-Cells, 16 NSM AShMs and prbly a 127mm main gun.
Displacement and measurements are unknown for now.

[Poiuytrewq]

IF the Australians cancel the Hunter which looks a possibility, with the recent precedent set by the Sept 2021 cancellation of the multi-billion deal for the 12 French submarines to be replaced by AUKUS, would think by far the strongest favourite to replace the Hunter would be the US Navy (Fincantieri) Constellation class frigate, currently it seems Australians are on a buying spree of US military hardware.

It is far from assured that integrating Australias requirements on Constellation would be any easier than on Hunter.

I would suggest that if BAE cannot integrate the requirement perhaps the requirement should be revisited before moving on to a new hull.

The 96 cell HunterB2 is a potentially game changing capability both for the RAN and RN.

[SiVisPacemParaBellum]

tkMS's pitch towards a Tier 2 Combatant/partial Hunter replacement.
Reportedly called Meko-A210 - based on Meko-A400 which doesn't make any sense.
Features 64 MK41 VLS-Cells, 16 NSM AShMs and prbly a 127mm main gun.
Displacement and measurements are unknown for now.

32MK41 Cells

[new guy]

IF the Australians cancel the Hunter which looks a possibility, with the recent precedent set by the Sept 2021 cancellation of the multi-billion deal for the 12 French submarines to be replaced by AUKUS, would think by far the strongest favourite to replace the Hunter would be the US Navy (Fincantieri) Constellation class frigate, currently it seems Australians are on a buying spree of US military hardware.

Stupid, why would they do that? Not like constellation will be any better.

[new guy]

IF the Australians cancel the Hunter which looks a possibility, with the recent precedent set by the Sept 2021 cancellation of the multi-billion deal for the 12 French submarines to be replaced by AUKUS, would think by far the strongest favourite to replace the Hunter would be the US Navy (Fincantieri) Constellation class frigate, currently it seems Australians are on a buying spree of US military hardware.

It is far from assured that integrating Australias requirements on Constellation would be any easier than on Hunter.

I would suggest that if BAE cannot integrate the requirement perhaps the requirement should be revisited before moving on to a new hull.

The 96 cell HunterB2 is a potentially game changing capability both for the RAN and RN.

BAE rep said take away 5inch, get total of 128.

[inch]

RN should order 2 aswell,

[new guy]

RN should order 2 aswell,

Show the money

[new guy]

Some interesting proposals at this years Indo Pacific trade show (via the indispensable Twitter feed of Gregory Knowles):
https://twitter.com/2805662

Navantia Hobart class evolution:


And their corvette offering:


the accompanying graphics
https://x.com/sweeneygov/status/1721704 ... 48391?s=20
https://x.com/sweeneygov/status/1721703 ... 44064?s=20

For the corvette, it imediately gives me the feel that ANZAC class lessons have left the chat...

[NickC]

IF the Australians cancel the Hunter which looks a possibility, with the recent precedent set by the Sept 2021 cancellation of the multi-billion deal for the 12 French submarines to be replaced by AUKUS, would think by far the strongest favourite to replace the Hunter would be the US Navy (Fincantieri) Constellation class frigate, currently it seems Australians are on a buying spree of US military hardware.

It is far from assured that integrating Australias requirements on Constellation would be any easier than on Hunter.

I would suggest that if BAE cannot integrate the requirement perhaps the requirement should be revisited before moving on to a new hull.

The 96 cell HunterB2 is a potentially game changing capability both for the RAN and RN.

Unknown if the Australians will persist in incorporating CEFAR X, S and L radars in a new frigate which appears to be the main cost and increased displacement drivers of the Hunter. Possibility Australians could sacrifice the CEFAR radars for a standard Constellation fit if it promised to half the cost of the Hunter? Maybe the US Navy would offer the proposed Mk II Constellation with an increased number Mk41 VLS cells over the current 32, there appears to be mindset that US military kit is the best, we have seen the same recently in UK with the possible buy of the 3,000 JAGMs instead of Brimstones.

The 96 cell HunterB2 shows what I always thought is what a waste of space is the T26 mission equipment bay which was designed for Special Forces, personally don't think there is any logic in a frigate CONOPS for a SF element, better left to the properly fitted out amphib ships.

[inch]

RN should order 2 aswell,

Show the money

Well the government can manage to spend billions on a totally useless train project, should be able to afford 2 extra ships ,now manning maybe another issue I grant you

[Poiuytrewq]

Unknown if the Australians will persist in incorporating CEFAR X, S and L radars in a new frigate which appears to be the main cost and increased displacement drivers of the Hunter. Possibility Australians could sacrifice the CEFAR radars for a standard Constellation fit if it promised to half the cost of the Hunter? Maybe the US Navy would offer the proposed Mk II Constellation with an increased number Mk41 VLS cells over the current 32, there appears to be mindset that US military kit is the best, we have seen the same recently in UK with the possible buy of the 3,000 JAGMs instead of Brimstones.

When it comes down to it the Hunter still looks like the best option, add a 96 cell Batch2 and all boxes are ticked. It’s an Australian Arleigh Burke which was the original aspiration. What would Constellation add?

The 96 cell HunterB2 shows what I always thought is what a waste of space is the T26 mission equipment bay which was designed for Special Forces, personally don't think there is any logic in a frigate CONOPS for a SF element, better left to the properly fitted out amphib ships.

RN has a real chance to grow the Tier1 AAW fleet now and spend the money on capability rather than a super cruiser hull.

Will sense prevail?

[new guy]

RN should order 2 aswell,

Show the money

Well the government can manage to spend billions on a totally useless train project, should be able to afford 2 extra ships ,now manning maybe another issue I grant you

you said that to the wrong person.

[new guy]

IF the Australians cancel the Hunter which looks a possibility, with the recent precedent set by the Sept 2021 cancellation of the multi-billion deal for the 12 French submarines to be replaced by AUKUS, would think by far the strongest favourite to replace the Hunter would be the US Navy (Fincantieri) Constellation class frigate, currently it seems Australians are on a buying spree of US military hardware.

It is far from assured that integrating Australias requirements on Constellation would be any easier than on Hunter.

I would suggest that if BAE cannot integrate the requirement perhaps the requirement should be revisited before moving on to a new hull.

The 96 cell HunterB2 is a potentially game changing capability both for the RAN and RN.

Unknown if the Australians will persist in incorporating CEFAR X, S and L radars in a new frigate which appears to be the main cost and increased displacement drivers of the Hunter. Possibility Australians could sacrifice the CEFAR radars for a standard Constellation fit if it promised to half the cost of the Hunter? Maybe the US Navy would offer the proposed Mk II Constellation with an increased number Mk41 VLS cells over the current 32, there appears to be mindset that US military kit is the best, we have seen the same recently in UK with the possible buy of the 3,000 JAGMs instead of Brimstones.

The 96 cell HunterB2 shows what I always thought is what a waste of space is the T26 mission equipment bay which was designed for Special Forces, personally don't think there is any logic in a frigate CONOPS for a SF element, better left to the properly fitted out amphib ships.

1) yes, constellation is so much more logical.


2)The Infamous JAGM proposal


3) yes, MMB is useless. I wait for Repulse to argue against that before I shoot my shot.

[R686]

IF the Australians cancel the Hunter which looks a possibility, with the recent precedent set by the Sept 2021 cancellation of the multi-billion deal for the 12 French submarines to be replaced by AUKUS, would think by far the strongest favourite to replace the Hunter would be the US Navy (Fincantieri) Constellation class frigate, currently it seems Australians are on a buying spree of US military hardware.

Stupid, why would they do that? Not like constellation will be any better.

That just pushes the Anzac replacement further down the road.

Hunters will not be cancelled reduced maybe but not cancelled.

Using the Nuclear submarines as a yard stick is not comparing apples with apples.

AusGov will not piss off BAE they have too much presence in AU compared to Navel Group.

The submarine project was on a different scale conventional/ nuclear was a massive capability increase to the RAN

With the amount of potential red force submarines that could be lurking in our area of predominant operations the continued build of ASW frigates is a must for the RAN. I could understand it if they reduced Hunter and bought Hyūga-class that would be a capbilty leap for the RAN

[R686]

The 96 cell HunterB2 shows what I always thought is what a waste of space is the T26 mission equipment bay which was designed for Special Forces, personally don't think there is any logic in a frigate CONOPS for a SF element, better left to the properly fitted out amphib ships.

The Absalon-class is a ideal multi role frigate and are ideal when placed within a amphibious task group or independent operations. They are ideal for SF anti piracy or in the RAN case for the pre-landing force

[new guy]

The 96 cell HunterB2 shows what I always thought is what a waste of space is the T26 mission equipment bay which was designed for Special Forces, personally don't think there is any logic in a frigate CONOPS for a SF element, better left to the properly fitted out amphib ships.

The Absalon-class is a ideal multi role frigate and are ideal when placed within a amphibious task group or independent operations. They are ideal for SF anti piracy or in the RAN case for the pre-landing force

Only frigate in the world to have a vehicle deck, even stuff like BAE ASF and Singapore MRCS all only have a rear work deck for boats about half the size; plus boat emphinages.

Don't nessiserally support it either.

[R686]

The 96 cell HunterB2 shows what I always thought is what a waste of space is the T26 mission equipment bay which was designed for Special Forces, personally don't think there is any logic in a frigate CONOPS for a SF element, better left to the properly fitted out amphib ships.

The Absalon-class is a ideal multi role frigate and are ideal when placed within a amphibious task group or independent operations. They are ideal for SF anti piracy or in the RAN case for the pre-landing force

Only frigate in the world to have a vehicle deck, even stuff like BAE ASF and Singapore MRCS all only have a rear work deck for boats about half the size; plus boat emphinages.

Don't nessiserally support it either.

Each to there own I guess

I think an improved 3/4x Absalon-class would be ideal for the RAN covers a wide range of contingencies from SF - HADR