Raytheon Sentinel R1 (RAF)

Contains threads on Royal Air Force equipment of the past, present and future.
Dahedd
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Re: Raytheon Sentinel R1 (RAF)

Post by Dahedd »

Another very short sighted decision by the MoD :cry:

SW1
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Re: Raytheon Sentinel R1 (RAF)

Post by SW1 »

The numbers


Little J
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Re: Raytheon Sentinel R1 (RAF)

Post by Little J »

17 years, should have easily been double that...

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RichardIC
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Re: Raytheon Sentinel R1 (RAF)

Post by RichardIC »



This is the problem with micro fleets. Tiny numbers offering a niche capability. Just not sustainable.

Little J
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Re: Raytheon Sentinel R1 (RAF)

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: Raytheon Sentinel R1 (RAF)

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

14 yrs... OK, a quick-fit

But: where are the statements about the (or not just one?) replacement capability?
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)

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Re: Raytheon Sentinel R1 (RAF)

Post by Lord Jim »

They will probably bolt something onto the Protectors eventually.

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Re: Raytheon Sentinel R1 (RAF)

Post by SW1 »

Most requested air assets we had

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Re: Raytheon Sentinel R1 (RAF)

Post by Lord Jim »

The Canberra PR9 was also in very high demand, especially my the Americans.

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: Raytheon Sentinel R1 (RAF)

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

Lord Jim wrote:The Canberra PR9 was also in very high demand, especially my the Americans.
Well, the U2 camera and so along.

But not mentioned in the GW1 assets... while it was definitely 'there'
- from Cyprus; and not 'seen' :)
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)

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Re: Raytheon Sentinel R1 (RAF)

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SKB
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Re: Raytheon Sentinel R1 (RAF)

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2022 prediction: "The US Army has invented a spy plane out of a business jet. We're the first in the world to do it, so ner ner ner ner ner ner.." :roll: :thumbdown:

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Re: Raytheon Sentinel R1 (RAF)

Post by KiwiMuzz »

I saw a comment on Twitter that one reason Sentinel was binned was that it was a "corps-level asset for a brigade-level army". Ouch.

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Re: Raytheon Sentinel R1 (RAF)

Post by Ron5 »

SKB wrote: 17 Nov 2021, 17:41 2022 prediction: "The US Army has invented a spy plane out of a business jet. We're the first in the world to do it, so ner ner ner ner ner ner.." :roll: :thumbdown:

:thumbup:

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Re: Raytheon Sentinel R1 (RAF)

Post by abc123 »

KiwiMuzz wrote: 17 Nov 2021, 20:29 I saw a comment on Twitter that one reason Sentinel was binned was that it was a "corps-level asset for a brigade-level army". Ouch.
It somewhat makes a sense. on the other hand, things like Sentinels give additional strength to "brigade(if even that)-level Army".
Fortune favors brave sir, said Carrot cheerfully.
What's her position about heavily armed, well prepared and overmanned armies?
Oh, noone's ever heard of Fortune favoring them, sir.
According to General Tacticus, it's because they favor themselves…

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Re: Raytheon Sentinel R1 (RAF)

Post by SW1 »

Lucky for us then we don’t provide a corps level HQ for nato or are looking to invest in long range land fires capabilities that may require a standoff long stare capability to ID enemy movements along the nato border for engagement.

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Re: Raytheon Sentinel R1 (RAF)

Post by KiwiMuzz »

abc123 wrote: 19 Nov 2021, 13:54
KiwiMuzz wrote: 17 Nov 2021, 20:29 I saw a comment on Twitter that one reason Sentinel was binned was that it was a "corps-level asset for a brigade-level army". Ouch.
It somewhat makes a sense. on the other hand, things like Sentinels give additional strength to "brigade(if even that)-level Army".
Definitely, even though the truth behind the comment stings, being able to bring Sentinel to a coalition can help offset the smaller land component.

Little J
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Re: Raytheon Sentinel R1 (RAF)

Post by Little J »

Would have been quite useful to have these around right about now...
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Re: Raytheon Sentinel R1 (RAF)

Post by TheLoneRanger »

Little J wrote: 27 Feb 2022, 23:10 Would have been quite useful to have these around right about now...
Absolutely - the short term approach of the Mod and treasury is truly shocking. A few of the sentinels over Poland are worth their weight in gold right now!
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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: Raytheon Sentinel R1 (RAF)

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

The budget 'eggs' have been put in Watchkeeper, which is surveillance (and targeting) only and optimised for a brigade's sphere of influence... the range is of course more as it needs a runway!
- in Ukraine we re witnessing Corps-level warfare; and our corps assets are? Never mind that we can't field a corps
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Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)

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Re: Raytheon Sentinel R1 (RAF)

Post by SW1 »

Is been simply another lesson in the importance of strategic intelligence gathering and information sharing.

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Re: Raytheon Sentinel R1 (RAF)

Post by Lord Jim »

Well we all know where Watch keeper should be living and that is in the Recce/Precision Fires BCT as its organic ISTAR asset rather that putting it in the 1st Aviation Brigade or whatever.

As for Sentinel, I am sure the US Army will get a lot of use out of them whilst they are waiting for their new builds. They might even use some to the Sentinels hardware to cut costs. I think the new US Army platforms will be able to analyse the data on board as well as stream it via data link to a ground station, possibly speeding up the sensor to shooter cycle for high priority targets.

How survivable a platform like Sentinel would be in a contested area would be useful to know as would any capability to carry self protection pods and dispensers.

Strange how just as we are binning a very useful capability and its enablers the US is doing the opposite. Our Beechcraft platforms might be OK for COIN but they won't be going near any contested airspace. The could provide support for Ranger units t give them a credible ISTAR capability against the level of opposition they are most likely to meet though.

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Re: Raytheon Sentinel R1 (RAF)

Post by SW1 »

Lord Jim wrote: 01 Mar 2022, 16:39 Well we all know where Watch keeper should be living and that is in the Recce/Precision Fires BCT as its organic ISTAR asset rather that putting it in the 1st Aviation Brigade or whatever.

As for Sentinel, I am sure the US Army will get a lot of use out of them whilst they are waiting for their new builds. They might even use some to the Sentinels hardware to cut costs. I think the new US Army platforms will be able to analyse the data on board as well as stream it via data link to a ground station, possibly speeding up the sensor to shooter cycle for high priority targets.

How survivable a platform like Sentinel would be in a contested area would be useful to know as would any capability to carry self protection pods and dispensers.

Strange how just as we are binning a very useful capability and its enablers the US is doing the opposite. Our Beechcraft platforms might be OK for COIN but they won't be going near any contested airspace. The could provide support for Ranger units t give them a credible ISTAR capability against the level of opposition they are most likely to meet though.
Precisely because they fly high with good endurance they can stand off with a long stare to avoid being in the contested area. They also have an extremely useful part to play in ensuring hostilities do not start by providing information to shape the narrative and allowing counters to be planned before the need to fight.

They are no less survivable that any other aircraft that isn’t a fighter.

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: Raytheon Sentinel R1 (RAF)

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

Lord Jim wrote: 01 Mar 2022, 16:39 Watch keeper should be living and that is in the Recce/Precision Fires BCT
The half hundred, or so?
Lord Jim wrote: 01 Mar 2022, 16:39 Strange how just as we are binning a very useful capability and its enablers the US is doing the opposite
Agreed; but the ground stations are of shared std; aliies and all that...
SW1 wrote: 01 Mar 2022, 17:01 They are no less survivable that any other aircraft that isn’t a fighter.
How are we doing with the Very Big pods on Typhoons (as was the case with Tornados... armed recce)?
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)

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Re: Raytheon Sentinel R1 (RAF)

Post by SW1 »

ArmChairCivvy wrote: 01 Mar 2022, 18:17
Lord Jim wrote: 01 Mar 2022, 16:39 Watch keeper should be living and that is in the Recce/Precision Fires BCT
The half hundred, or so?
Lord Jim wrote: 01 Mar 2022, 16:39 Strange how just as we are binning a very useful capability and its enablers the US is doing the opposite
Agreed; but the ground stations are of shared std; aliies and all that...
SW1 wrote: 01 Mar 2022, 17:01 They are no less survivable that any other aircraft that isn’t a fighter.
How are we doing with the Very Big pods on Typhoons (as was the case with Tornados... armed recce)?
Did notice the typhoons seemed to be operating with litening pods on, think there at version V now.

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