Airbus A400M Atlas (RAF)

Contains threads on Royal Air Force equipment of the past, present and future.
User avatar
RichardIC
Senior Member
Posts: 1230
Joined: 10 May 2015, 16:59
Has liked: 1 time
Been liked: 0
United Kingdom

Re: Airbus A400M Atlas (RAF)

Post by RichardIC »

Lord Jim wrote:We really could do with utilising the AAR option of at least a few of our A400, if only for the Rotary fleet. Having one in the Falklands to support the Typhoons would be useful as well rather than use a Voyager.
The Falklands is posing a real dilemma now that the C-130 are going. It would seem to make sense to replace one C-130 and one Voyager with two AAR equipped A400s that can perform tanker, maritime patrol, SAR, casevac if a contract variation could be agreed with Airtanker.

I've read very little/nothing about Airtanker operations in the Falklands but I'd imagine having to maintain a Voyager in the open and retain crew and technicians down south is a burden they may wish to give up, depending on how commercially rewarding it is.

SW1
Senior Member
Posts: 2819
Joined: 27 Aug 2018, 19:12
Has liked: 15 times
Been liked: 35 times
United Kingdom

Re: Airbus A400M Atlas (RAF)

Post by SW1 »

RichardIC wrote:
Lord Jim wrote:We really could do with utilising the AAR option of at least a few of our A400, if only for the Rotary fleet. Having one in the Falklands to support the Typhoons would be useful as well rather than use a Voyager.
The Falklands is posing a real dilemma now that the C-130 are going. It would seem to make sense to replace one C-130 and one Voyager with two AAR equipped A400s that can perform tanker, maritime patrol, SAR, casevac if a contract variation could be agreed with Airtanker.

I've read very little/nothing about Airtanker operations in the Falklands but I'd imagine having to maintain a Voyager in the open and retain crew and technicians down south is a burden they may wish to give up, depending on how commercially rewarding it is.
The a400m replaced the Hercules in the Falklands a few years ago

SW1
Senior Member
Posts: 2819
Joined: 27 Aug 2018, 19:12
Has liked: 15 times
Been liked: 35 times
United Kingdom

Re: Airbus A400M Atlas (RAF)

Post by SW1 »

ArmChairCivvy wrote:
SW1 wrote:You will want to clear a number of the parachute operations as the French Air Force has before we get to worrying about aar capability.
Do we need to do that, separately?

Isn't the next thing the 'drop' platform: the deliver other than men, e.g. vehicles?
We may use different parachutes to the french I believe

Ron5
Donator
Posts: 6329
Joined: 05 May 2015, 21:42
Has liked: 0
Been liked: 0
United States of America

Re: Airbus A400M Atlas (RAF)

Post by Ron5 »

topman wrote:
Ron5 wrote:
topman wrote:I'd disagree, which of the helicopters are ready to aar right?
Latest Marine Merlins. Shown equipped with refueling probes when they entered service.

Image
Like I said, I wonder how many are ready right now.
Oh dear, did Mr RAF forget the mighty wizard ?? :D :D :D :D

User avatar
RichardIC
Senior Member
Posts: 1230
Joined: 10 May 2015, 16:59
Has liked: 1 time
Been liked: 0
United Kingdom

Re: Airbus A400M Atlas (RAF)

Post by RichardIC »

SW1 wrote:The a400m replaced the Hercules in the Falklands a few years ago
Did it? That completely passed me by. Thank you.

I think the same logic may still apply regarding two A400s rather than two singletons. At least they could refuel each other.

andrew98
Member
Posts: 196
Joined: 05 May 2015, 22:28
Has liked: 0
Been liked: 0
United Kingdom

Re: Airbus A400M Atlas (RAF)

Post by andrew98 »

Less types of spares, possible less maintenance bodies there also?

User avatar
Tempest414
Senior Member
Posts: 3182
Joined: 04 Jan 2018, 23:39
Has liked: 3 times
Been liked: 13 times
France

Re: Airbus A400M Atlas (RAF)

Post by Tempest414 »

been a busy day here so far 2 French an one RAF A400's been in and out of the local airfield 4 stream passes over the farm at no more 300 ft also a tiger hanging around to the north might be working up to a local EX and night flying which about this time most years

SW1
Senior Member
Posts: 2819
Joined: 27 Aug 2018, 19:12
Has liked: 15 times
Been liked: 35 times
United Kingdom

Re: Airbus A400M Atlas (RAF)

Post by SW1 »

https://esut.de/en/2021/09/meldungen/29 ... bgenommen/


The European armaments agency OCCAR-EA approved the aircraft standard "New Standard Operating Clearance 2.5" (NSOC 2.5) on September 8th on behalf of the A400M program nations, according to a communication from the Federal Office for Equipment, Information Technology and Use of the Bundeswehr (BAAINBw) .

With the NSCO 2.5, the user nations have access to a large number of improvements for already delivered, but also for completely new capabilities. The Federal Office for Equipment, Information Technology and Use of the Federal Armed Forces names among others

the ability to simultaneously lower parachutists with automatically deployed parachutes,

the ability to set down loads using the pull-out method,

ground-system-independent instrument approaches
,
further optimized self-protection system (level 2b) and

an initial qualification for automatic low-level flight.

The OCCAR-EA also refers to reduced and military operating standards and the integrated calculation of aircraft performance with TOPOCS (Take-Off Performance On Board Computer System).

Online
Lord Jim
Senior Member
Posts: 6408
Joined: 10 Dec 2015, 02:15
Has liked: 10 times
Been liked: 41 times
United Kingdom

Re: Airbus A400M Atlas (RAF)

Post by Lord Jim »

I wonder how many we are pursuing?

SW1
Senior Member
Posts: 2819
Joined: 27 Aug 2018, 19:12
Has liked: 15 times
Been liked: 35 times
United Kingdom

Re: Airbus A400M Atlas (RAF)

Post by SW1 »


~UNiOnJaCk~
Member
Posts: 776
Joined: 03 May 2015, 16:19
Has liked: 2 times
Been liked: 5 times
United Kingdom

Re: Airbus A400M Atlas (RAF)

Post by ~UNiOnJaCk~ »

From UKDJ, possible additional A400M purchase later this decade: https://ukdefencejournal.org.uk/uk-plan ... -aircraft/

Make of it what you will. Would like to see the source myself.

Defiance
Donator
Posts: 815
Joined: 07 Oct 2015, 20:52
Has liked: 13 times
Been liked: 22 times
United Kingdom

Re: Airbus A400M Atlas (RAF)

Post by Defiance »

~UNiOnJaCk~ wrote: 06 Jan 2022, 20:16 Make of it what you will. Would like to see the source myself.
Found the source that got left out of the article (same source as the 'big RN projects' article) - Ctrl+F "Additional purchase of A400M" to find the entry.

https://committees.parliament.uk/public ... 6/default/
These users liked the author Defiance for the post:
~UNiOnJaCk~

bobp
Senior Member
Posts: 2361
Joined: 06 May 2015, 07:52
Has liked: 1 time
Been liked: 3 times
United Kingdom

Re: Airbus A400M Atlas (RAF)

Post by bobp »

Defiance wrote: 06 Jan 2022, 21:30
~UNiOnJaCk~ wrote: 06 Jan 2022, 20:16 Make of it what you will. Would like to see the source myself.
Found the source that got left out of the article (same source as the 'big RN projects' article) - Ctrl+F "Additional purchase of A400M" to find the entry.

https://committees.parliament.uk/public ... 6/default/
So an unknown quantity of A400 to be purchased sometime in the future, lets hope it is enough to replace the 14 C130j we are to lose.

Defiance
Donator
Posts: 815
Joined: 07 Oct 2015, 20:52
Has liked: 13 times
Been liked: 22 times
United Kingdom

Re: Airbus A400M Atlas (RAF)

Post by Defiance »

bobp wrote: 06 Jan 2022, 21:45 So an unknown quantity of A400 to be purchased sometime in the future, lets hope it is enough to replace the 14 C130j we are to lose.
Exactly the sort of detail that makes it an easy cut. Can't get hauled over the coals when nobody knows how many you were going to buy. Personally I expect any order uplift will be to offset A400M availability issues rather than meeting C-130J capacity.

User avatar
Jensy
Member
Posts: 576
Joined: 05 Aug 2016, 19:44
Has liked: 32 times
Been liked: 4 times
United Kingdom

Re: Airbus A400M Atlas (RAF)

Post by Jensy »

Defiance wrote: 06 Jan 2022, 21:52
bobp wrote: 06 Jan 2022, 21:45 So an unknown quantity of A400 to be purchased sometime in the future, lets hope it is enough to replace the 14 C130j we are to lose.
Exactly the sort of detail that makes it an easy cut. Can't get hauled over the coals when nobody knows how many you were going to buy. Personally I expect any order uplift will be to offset A400M availability issues rather than meeting C-130J capacity.
Cynically I wonder if this would be an 'increase' to the original order of 25.

I wonder how desperate the Germans and Spanish will get to shift their surplus aircraft by the end of the decade? Until they do, the production run is going to end sooner than I'm sure Airbus would like.

SW1
Senior Member
Posts: 2819
Joined: 27 Aug 2018, 19:12
Has liked: 15 times
Been liked: 35 times
United Kingdom

Re: Airbus A400M Atlas (RAF)

Post by SW1 »

Jensy wrote: 07 Jan 2022, 00:55
Defiance wrote: 06 Jan 2022, 21:52
bobp wrote: 06 Jan 2022, 21:45 So an unknown quantity of A400 to be purchased sometime in the future, lets hope it is enough to replace the 14 C130j we are to lose.
Exactly the sort of detail that makes it an easy cut. Can't get hauled over the coals when nobody knows how many you were going to buy. Personally I expect any order uplift will be to offset A400M availability issues rather than meeting C-130J capacity.
Cynically I wonder if this would be an 'increase' to the original order of 25.

I wonder how desperate the Germans and Spanish will get to shift their surplus aircraft by the end of the decade? Until they do, the production run is going to end sooner than I'm sure Airbus would like.
The Germans don’t have any surplus aircraft they are taking all 53 of them now. Will operate 10 with Hungary in a joint Sqn
These users liked the author SW1 for the post:
Jensy

Defiance
Donator
Posts: 815
Joined: 07 Oct 2015, 20:52
Has liked: 13 times
Been liked: 22 times
United Kingdom

Re: Airbus A400M Atlas (RAF)

Post by Defiance »

Jensy wrote: 07 Jan 2022, 00:55 Cynically I wonder if this would be an 'increase' to the original order of 25.
That's the probable outcome if any get purchased. Pick a number, cut it to save money, reverse the cut but frame it as expansion instead, job done
These users liked the author Defiance for the post (total 4):
imperialmanJensyserge750KiwiMuzz

User avatar
imperialman
Donator
Posts: 87
Joined: 01 May 2015, 17:16
Has liked: 1 time
Been liked: 4 times
Contact:
United Kingdom

Re: Airbus A400M Atlas (RAF)

Post by imperialman »

~UNiOnJaCk~ wrote: 06 Jan 2022, 20:16 From UKDJ, possible additional A400M purchase later this decade: https://ukdefencejournal.org.uk/uk-plan ... -aircraft/

Make of it what you will. Would like to see the source myself.
The source pdf is linked to at the top of the article, apologies should maybe make it clearer.

EDIT: Sorry, just noticed you've found it.
These users liked the author imperialman for the post:
~UNiOnJaCk~

~UNiOnJaCk~
Member
Posts: 776
Joined: 03 May 2015, 16:19
Has liked: 2 times
Been liked: 5 times
United Kingdom

Re: Airbus A400M Atlas (RAF)

Post by ~UNiOnJaCk~ »

Thank you for the pointers to the source all.

Also noticed that Gabriele Molinelli has tweeted some additional snippets from the same document, unrelated to A400M so not for here but interesting pointers nonetheless.

Online
Lord Jim
Senior Member
Posts: 6408
Joined: 10 Dec 2015, 02:15
Has liked: 10 times
Been liked: 41 times
United Kingdom

Re: Airbus A400M Atlas (RAF)

Post by Lord Jim »

I would like to see at least ten more purchase to form a pool that three front line Squadrons could use. The funding is likely as there will be an increased need to support all these forward deployed assets and it would be uneconomical to use the C-17s all of the time, and the latter have already been worked very hard over the past decade or so. In fact this last reason would also apply to the Atlas fleet, spreading the hours over more airframes, something the F-35 project office and that of every other platform should think about. The RAF's front line units are very fragile with far too little attrition airframes for peacetime let alone during a war.
These users liked the author Lord Jim for the post (total 3):
KiwiMuzzwargame_insomniacDigger22

Post Reply