UK Mobile Fires Platform
Posted: 18 Mar 2022, 08:24
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So will Boxer be the only wheeled vehicle amongst the tracked - Challenger 3, Ajax (whenever it is ever ready), GMLRS - or will they get a HIMARS?Lord Jim wrote: ↑18 Mar 2022, 10:04 The K9A2 will be a very good weapon system when built but is it the right one of the British Army. Lockheed Martin do ever so slightly over state the advantages of being a tracked platform compared to the wheeled platforms under consideration, and conveniently fail to mention any of the disadvantages of a tracked weapon system. It will be interesting to see what the Army makes of it once it is available for trials. The Army has already looked at many of the wheeled platforms, piggybacking on teh US Army's trials last year, for a replacement of teh M777 in the Stryker Brigades.
I like what I have heard of the K9A2 and it seems very suitable for use in Scandinavia and Northern Europe.
They've only developed and built the Warrior WCSP and the AJAX Turret.wargame_insomniac wrote: ↑18 Mar 2022, 17:41 What do Lockheed Martin site in Ampthill currently produce? I am relieved if we can manufacture it locally, so long as as not a start up manufacturing like Generall Dynamics site that had issues with Ajax AFV.
This is also a MAN SV 10x10 155mm shown at DSEI.
You maybe getting confused with the Polish Krab SPG that has the Turret of the AS-90 and the hull of the K-9. I believe it even has the 52 calibre barrel we could have had is we hadn't messed up the procurement programme and decided the existing 39 calibre barrel would suffice.whitelancer wrote: ↑18 Mar 2022, 19:45 Wasn't the hull of the K9 based on that of AS90? What would be the difference between the K9 and an updated AS90?
the Boxer based RCH155 is probably the most expensive of the wheeled options for the Mobile Fires requirement. Others option as the afore mentioned MAN 10x10, MAN/Archer, Caesar 8x8, to name but a few. My vote would go to MAN/Archer together with its Ammunition Supply Vehicle using the same chassis and able to rapidly reload the SPG's magazine. A lorry based option would most likely be the cheapest option as well as having the cheapest training and running costs, then there is Boxer and finally the most expensive to purchase, train on and operate we have tracked platforms like the K-9.RunningStrong wrote: ↑18 Mar 2022, 19:54This is also a MAN SV 10x10 155mm shown at DSEI.
As Boxer will cover several roles within any formation, it will be a significant part of any organisation. But likely also supported by Jackal Recce and Panther/Foxhound C4I vehicles.
Archer may be out given only Croatia operates it. Or it might be chosen cause it's BAELord Jim wrote: ↑19 Mar 2022, 06:13the Boxer based RCH155 is probably the most expensive of the wheeled options for the Mobile Fires requirement. Others option as the afore mentioned MAN 10x10, MAN/Archer, Caesar 8x8, to name but a few. My vote would go to MAN/Archer together with its Ammunition Supply Vehicle using the same chassis and able to rapidly reload the SPG's magazine. A lorry based option would most likely be the cheapest option as well as having the cheapest training and running costs, then there is Boxer and finally the most expensive to purchase, train on and operate we have tracked platforms like the K-9.RunningStrong wrote: ↑18 Mar 2022, 19:54This is also a MAN SV 10x10 155mm shown at DSEI.
As Boxer will cover several roles within any formation, it will be a significant part of any organisation. But likely also supported by Jackal Recce and Panther/Foxhound C4I vehicles.
The latter may have the advantage of mobility in extreme terrain like northern Norway, but it will have a more substantial support train. In addition I am not sure the force we could be sending up north will be of the mechanised variety as I mentioned in a post elsewhere. Highly mobile light infantry maybe more useful.
I think that British Army is still having 8 AS-90 per battery for total of 24 per regiment. At least that was the case in 2019.
I recommend keep reading the gunner website or magazine each month. If I want to guess, they just complement 5 Regiment Royal Artillery?Lord Jim wrote: ↑21 Mar 2022, 19:19 Does anyone have any further information of these Tactical Group Batteries equipped with Ajax or Jackal? Are these the groupings of the Joint Fires platforms or teams? Whatever they are they seem to be very important for the reorganisation of the Royal Artillery. Also are the M270 Batteries still comprised of four launchers? That number I correct at present whereas the AS-90 Batteries are six platforms each. I think the latter used to be eight strong in the 1980s and 1990s.
I noted that the number of Ajax and Jackal groups mapped to the number of Ajax and Jackal cavalry regiments in the two "heavy" BCTs and the "deep fires recce" BCT - so assumed they were joint fires variants that got attached to those recce regiments to link back to the fires element.Lord Jim wrote: ↑21 Mar 2022, 19:19 Does anyone have any further information of these Tactical Group Batteries equipped with Ajax or Jackal? Are these the groupings of the Joint Fires platforms or teams? Whatever they are they seem to be very important for the reorganisation of the Royal Artillery. Also are the M270 Batteries still comprised of four launchers? That number I correct at present whereas the AS-90 Batteries are six platforms each. I think the latter used to be eight strong in the 1980s and 1990s.
Squadron designation is misleading here and it is actually a battalion by its strength. Currently, recce squadron in US Army Armoured BCT, has three recce troops (read companies) and one tank troop (company) for total of 39 Bradley M3A2 CFV and 14 Abrams MBT, plus 6 120mm mortars. So it is on par or even stronger than British Army recce regiment.
Ah ok, fair enough - so scratch the direct fire support comment in my post.sol wrote: ↑22 Mar 2022, 09:59Squadron designation is misleading here and it is actually a battalion by its strength. Currently, recce squadron in US Army Armoured BCT, has three recce troops (read companies) and one tank troop (company) for total of 39 Bradley M3A2 CFV and 14 Abrams MBT, plus 6 120mm mortars. So it is on par or even stronger than British Army recce regiment.
Not the hull but its suspension.whitelancer wrote: ↑18 Mar 2022, 19:45 Wasn't the hull of the K9 based on that of AS90? What would be the difference between the K9 and an updated AS90?
Polish Krab was a 20-yr project, in its production form into the third gun option and also the hull was changed to K9's (hence the lineage back to AS90). The turret is more specifically the Braveheart one, ie. the one we never purchased... and may now be having a rethink?Lord Jim wrote: ↑19 Mar 2022, 06:03You maybe getting confused with the Polish Krab SPG that has the Turret of the AS-90 and the hull of the K-9. I believe it even has the 52 calibre barrel we could have had is we hadn't messed up the procurement programme and decided the existing 39 calibre barrel would suffice.whitelancer wrote: ↑18 Mar 2022, 19:45 Wasn't the hull of the K9 based on that of AS90? What would be the difference between the K9 and an updated AS90?