Dassault Falcon 900LX

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Ianmb17
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Dassault Falcon 900LX

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Re: Dassault Falcon 900LX

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Someone got the felt tips out quickly! (Obviously just fan art).

Interesting to think that the 146 fleet went from their rather elegant red tails to a more low-key livery. Will be interesting to see what happens with these.



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Re: Dassault Falcon 900LX

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Good choice but I'm quite surprised they went with this rather than a Bombardier/Global Express. 3 engines be a factor?

Lots of grumbles on Facebook & other forums.

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Re: Dassault Falcon 900LX

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These are more a replacement for the HS-125's with A321's replacing the 146's in real terms
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Re: Dassault Falcon 900LX

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Dahedd wrote: 13 Feb 2022, 01:43 Good choice but I'm quite surprised they went with this rather than a Bombardier/Global Express. 3 engines be a factor?

Lots of grumbles on Facebook & other forums.
They should be grumbling at BAE... For a poor strategic decision made decades ago.

As someone who would have gladly replaced the entire MPA/surveillance/VIP fleet with GlobEx variants, I'm inclined to agree.

However for this 8-10 pax role, the Challenger would have probably been a better fit, albeit with reduced UK content.
Tempest414 wrote: 13 Feb 2022, 08:33 These are more a replacement for the HS-125's with A321's replacing the 146's in real terms
Agreed. Though the 900LX has much longer legs than the old 125s.

With Vespina, 2x A321-200LRs and 2x Falcon 900LX, we have a rather well balanced VIP fleet comparable to most Western democracies of our size.

Not sure why we've decided to go about acquiring them in such an eccentric, inefficient and furtive manner. Though the press/public do seem to think anything more than a return Wizz Air flight is excessive...

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Re: Dassault Falcon 900LX

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The grumbling is largely around selecting yet another aircraft with next to no uk content when other options that do are available, though if your really clutching at straws you could say IOW does work on tails for dassualt. It striking the contempt this government has for our aviation sector.

Are we sure that the a321 deal continues after these biz jets are added? The fact they have been promoted by MOD as 146 replacements is strange as mentioned there not really equivalent. In the commercial world the RJ replacement is really seen as the a220-100 as seen in European airlines that used to fly the type principly Swiss. Would also of had plenty of range in a more vip fit.

Global express also valid option but less likely once they were attempting to expunge sentinel as fast as possible though I expect there much for expensive that what has been bought no one wants tri jet aircraft anymore.

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Re: Dassault Falcon 900LX

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SW1 wrote: 13 Feb 2022, 17:03 Are we sure that the a321 deal continues after these biz jets are added? The fact they have been promoted by MOD as 146 replacements is strange as mentioned there not really equivalent. In the commercial world the RJ replacement is really seen as the a220-100 as seen in European airlines that used to fly the type principly Swiss. Would also of had plenty of range in a more vip fit.
There was some talk of the A321s being a supplement to Vespina for post-Brexit global engagement. How long that's going to last is anyone's guess.

The A220 (or TwoTwenty :sick: ) would have been my first choice for all the roles above. Almost as much a British aircraft as it was Canadian.

However I don't think Bombardier or Airbus have showed any interest in developing it as such.

As you say, it has the range to match the A321 and arguably decreases the need for a Voyager to be moonlighting as a VIP transport.

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Re: Dassault Falcon 900LX

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Jensy wrote: 13 Feb 2022, 17:59
SW1 wrote: 13 Feb 2022, 17:03 Are we sure that the a321 deal continues after these biz jets are added? The fact they have been promoted by MOD as 146 replacements is strange as mentioned there not really equivalent. In the commercial world the RJ replacement is really seen as the a220-100 as seen in European airlines that used to fly the type principly Swiss. Would also of had plenty of range in a more vip fit.
There was some talk of the A321s being a supplement to Vespina for post-Brexit global engagement. How long that's going to last is anyone's guess.

The A220 (or TwoTwenty :sick: ) would have been my first choice for all the roles above. Almost as much a British aircraft as it was Canadian.

However I don't think Bombardier or Airbus have showed any interest in developing it as such.

As you say, it has the range to match the A321 and arguably decreases the need for a Voyager to be moonlighting as a VIP transport.
I’m not sure what you mean about developing it? If you mean adding a DAS system to it then it could be done in U.K. doesn’t have to be the oem that does it directly.

Voyager as a VIP transport I have no problem with but there is only one of them. If I was in charge of the defence review for a day it would of been the voyager fleet I would of looked to expand to be honest.

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Re: Dassault Falcon 900LX

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SW1 wrote: 13 Feb 2022, 18:38 I’m not sure what you mean about developing it? If you mean adding a DAS system to it then it could be done in U.K. doesn’t have to be the oem that does it directly.
I was wishfully talking about using the A220 (or C-Series) as a platform for the roles now filled by P-8, soon E-7 and formerly Sentinel. Though the moment has well passed, at least for the mid term.

I would hope a DAS ends up on all of these aircraft. Agreed that there's arguments for going with a third party supplier, rather than the OEM. MUSIC from Elbit being a strong option.

Found it interesting that the A321 was reportedly fitted with small arms storage. Certainly not needed often on EU shuttle diplomacy.

Certainly a strong argument for more A330s, though I'd want the full combi/cargo spec. Especially with the loss of Hercules and the grey 146s.

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Re: Dassault Falcon 900LX

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Jensy wrote: 13 Feb 2022, 23:45
SW1 wrote: 13 Feb 2022, 18:38 I’m not sure what you mean about developing it? If you mean adding a DAS system to it then it could be done in U.K. doesn’t have to be the oem that does it directly.
I was wishfully talking about using the A220 (or C-Series) as a platform for the roles now filled by P-8, soon E-7 and formerly Sentinel. Though the moment has well passed, at least for the mid term.

I would hope a DAS ends up on all of these aircraft. Agreed that there's arguments for going with a third party supplier, rather than the OEM. MUSIC from Elbit being a strong option.

Found it interesting that the A321 was reportedly fitted with small arms storage. Certainly not needed often on EU shuttle diplomacy.

Certainly a strong argument for more A330s, though I'd want the full combi/cargo spec. Especially with the loss of Hercules and the grey 146s.
Think the RAF prefer the northrup das systems.

Small arms lockers are quite common on vip aircraft.

OEMs don’t or won’t develop special mission a/c without interest from a customer there is simply too many sensor or configuration options.
You have people like Raytheon at broughton and Marshalls in the who have the design integration and assembly experience to take in production green a/c and integrate what is asked for. It’s what the like of IAI and Saab do as well. It’s entirely a lack of interest at MoD.

Voyager in its present configuration can take 30 plus tonnes of cargo in the form of 8 463l pallets which is 1 less than a a400m. To add the passenger deck as cargo is quite a significant modification and don’t think it’s entirely worth it.

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Re: Dassault Falcon 900LX

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https://www.raf.mod.uk/news/articles/la ... -envoy-iv/

A new aircraft type to Royal Air Force service is to be named the ‘Envoy IV’ in a nod both to its crucial role in defence diplomacy and to previous Envoy aircraft in RAF service.

Two new Dassault 900LX aircraft have been purchased to replace the BAe146 aircraft that were withdrawn from Service in March. The new Envoy aircraft will be based at RAF Northolt with No 32 (The Royal) Squadron, initially under contract with Centreline AV Ltd. For the first two years, the aircraft will be operated by mixed crews of RAF and Centreline staff, before upgrading to a full military and operational capability in 2024.

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Re: Dassault Falcon 900LX

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The two aircraft in royal use
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