Me me laugh.
If this is true, a bit mean turkey!
Turkish Armed Forces
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shark bait
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Re: Turkish Armed Forces
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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: Turkish Armed Forces
Good that someone said it... though in that particular area there are two Syrian Turkoman bdes (and a third nearer to Kobane) which are aligned with the West - Turkey included - and the Kurds. So may be not true in that microcosm, but worth some scrutiny more widely.arfah wrote:Russia accuses Turkey of (a pre planned action and) that the terrain below is used for smuggling and pro-Da'esh activities
- and Turkey must have got some questions to that effect in the NATO meeting that ensued from the incident
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)
Re: Turkish Armed Forces
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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: Turkish Armed Forces
The quote from RT (above) is already one step ahead, but vice. news.com has collated stuff drom Russian media & social media:
""Is the downed Russian plane revenge for the fact that our aviation bombed an ISIS oil storage facility and refinery? Turkey is for ISIS?" tweeted nationalist writer and television pundit Alexander Prokhanov, referring to widely publicized strikes on oil infrastructure in Syria last week.
On state television channel Rossiya 24, Middle East analyst Yevgeny Satanovsky argued that Erdogan had "gone mental" after Russia obstructed his plans for "liquidation of Syria."
"We stepped on the most painful part of his organism, on his wallet and on the feeling that the sultan can do whatever he wants," Satanovsky said.
Even Ilya Varlamov, a popular blogger who was a fixture of the anti-Putin street protests of 2011-13, was clearly emotional as he live-blogged the developments around the SU-24. "The Turks have gone fucking insane, of course," he tweeted.
Skepticism of Turkey's actions ran high, regardless of whether the Russian jet violated its airspace. Former pilot Vladimir Popov said on Rossiya 24 that the SU-24 could only have been over Turkish territory for a matter of seconds or minutes. The pilots "would know that they could accompany us protecting their borders, but they couldn't have expected an attack," he said.
The White House later said the same thing, reported the Guardian. Initial indications were that the Russian incursion into Turkish airspace lasted just a few seconds, said a US official.
Several television pundits called on Russia to retaliate for the loss of its pilots. Satanovsky said "nothing should be left" of the Syrian Turkmen-populated area where the pilots came down if it was confirmed they had been killed."
""Is the downed Russian plane revenge for the fact that our aviation bombed an ISIS oil storage facility and refinery? Turkey is for ISIS?" tweeted nationalist writer and television pundit Alexander Prokhanov, referring to widely publicized strikes on oil infrastructure in Syria last week.
On state television channel Rossiya 24, Middle East analyst Yevgeny Satanovsky argued that Erdogan had "gone mental" after Russia obstructed his plans for "liquidation of Syria."
"We stepped on the most painful part of his organism, on his wallet and on the feeling that the sultan can do whatever he wants," Satanovsky said.
Even Ilya Varlamov, a popular blogger who was a fixture of the anti-Putin street protests of 2011-13, was clearly emotional as he live-blogged the developments around the SU-24. "The Turks have gone fucking insane, of course," he tweeted.
Skepticism of Turkey's actions ran high, regardless of whether the Russian jet violated its airspace. Former pilot Vladimir Popov said on Rossiya 24 that the SU-24 could only have been over Turkish territory for a matter of seconds or minutes. The pilots "would know that they could accompany us protecting their borders, but they couldn't have expected an attack," he said.
The White House later said the same thing, reported the Guardian. Initial indications were that the Russian incursion into Turkish airspace lasted just a few seconds, said a US official.
Several television pundits called on Russia to retaliate for the loss of its pilots. Satanovsky said "nothing should be left" of the Syrian Turkmen-populated area where the pilots came down if it was confirmed they had been killed."
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)
Re: Turkish Armed Forces
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GastonGlocker
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Re: Turkish Armed Forces
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Re: Turkish Armed Forces
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WhitestElephant
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Re: Turkish Armed Forces
Apparently Turkey gave repeated warnings. Interesting they didn't resort to shooting it down this time, perhaps because it isn't a lone and vulnerable Su-24 this time around? Also since the last incident, the Russians have beefed up the border with SAM defences and fighter patrols.arfah wrote:Turkey accuses Russia of another airspace violation, this time by an SU34 Fullback.
Russia denies and states it's Turkish propaganda.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news
Though we are not now that strength which in old days moved earth and heaven, that which we are, we are. - Lord Tennyson (Ulysses)
Re: Turkish Armed Forces
Turkish Navy MELTEM II CASA CN-235 Maritime Patrol Aircraft Tracked Russian Navy Corvette
http://www.navyrecognition.com/index.ph ... ew&id=3581According to Russian media, a Turkish Navy Meltem II CASA CN-235 Maritime Patrol Aircraft (MPA) tracked two Russian Navy Black Sea fleet surface vessels during their transit to the Mediterranean Sea. The two vessels are likely Project 21631 small missile ship (Buyan-M class corvette) Zelyony Dol and the ocean-going mine-sweeper Kovrovets. We reported about their deployment last week.
Thales was the prime contractor for the Meltem II programme, which called for the delivery of six maritime patrol aircraft for the Turkish Navy and three maritime surveillance aircraft for the Turkish Coast Guard. The aircraft are based on modified CASA CN-235 platforms.
The Meltem II aircraft of the Turkish Navy are fitted with an ASELFLIR-200 Airborne Thermal Imaging System by Aselsan, Airbus Defence and Space AN/AAR-60 Missile Warning System, CAE AN/ASQ-508(V) MAD system. Thales supplied a number of systems as well: the AMASCOS solution (Airborne MAritime Situation & Control System), the DR 3000A ESM system and the Ocean Master 400 Mk2 radar.
Meltem II MPAs can deploy the Mk46 NEARTIP Mod 5 torpedo, as well as AN/SSQ-53E DIFAR and AN/SSQ-62D DICASS sonobuoys. It is also fitted with the AN/ALE-47 Airborne Countermeasures Dispenser System by BAE Systems.
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GastonGlocker
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Re: Turkish Armed Forces
Turkey doing what it does:
http://www.al-monitor.com/pulse/origina ... osity.html
http://www.al-monitor.com/pulse/origina ... osity.html
Re: Turkish Armed Forces
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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: Turkish Armed Forces
Let's see if the partial cease fire in Syria starts/holds. Deadlines on declaring intentions run to 26 Feb.
There is a plan B by those who feel they have not been able to influence the developments sufficiently:
"Ankara thinks there are two ways it can return to Syria's playing field, from which it was excluded after a Turkish F-16 shot down a Russian Su-24 warplane Nov. 24.
The first is with a "Sunni anti-IS air force" led by Ankara. If it can persuade Washington, Ankara wants to use this Sunni air force inside Syria with the participation of Saudi Arabia and Qatar. At the moment, six Saudi F-15s are in joint training with Turkish pilots at Turkey’s air combat training center in Konya.
Their training includes joint air operations and air-ground coordination. At the end of February, another 20 Saudi F-15s are expected at Incirlik Air Base. There are also reports that Qatari planes are already at Incirlik but have yet to become operational. Can the Sunni air force Turkey is trying to put together with Saudi Arabia and Qatar carry out joint operations in Syria? The United States will have to answer this question, because the Sunni air force will be Plan B in the hands of the United States in its strategic negotiations with Russia. This force is also needed for anti-IS attacks against Raqqa and Deir ez-Zor. Ankara and Riyadh are impatiently awaiting US approval to attack IS, which will open the gates of Syria to them."
Read more: http://www.al-monitor.com/pulse/origina ... z40xiVdYkl
The other option is to shell forces supported by Russian air in the West and US air in the East... where would that leave Turkey? The other main actors are Assad-Iran-Hezbollah (acting as one) and IS (with a lesser Al Qaida aligned supporting wing). So Turkey would be acting against all others involved except IS et al... not a good place to be in?
There is a plan B by those who feel they have not been able to influence the developments sufficiently:
"Ankara thinks there are two ways it can return to Syria's playing field, from which it was excluded after a Turkish F-16 shot down a Russian Su-24 warplane Nov. 24.
The first is with a "Sunni anti-IS air force" led by Ankara. If it can persuade Washington, Ankara wants to use this Sunni air force inside Syria with the participation of Saudi Arabia and Qatar. At the moment, six Saudi F-15s are in joint training with Turkish pilots at Turkey’s air combat training center in Konya.
Their training includes joint air operations and air-ground coordination. At the end of February, another 20 Saudi F-15s are expected at Incirlik Air Base. There are also reports that Qatari planes are already at Incirlik but have yet to become operational. Can the Sunni air force Turkey is trying to put together with Saudi Arabia and Qatar carry out joint operations in Syria? The United States will have to answer this question, because the Sunni air force will be Plan B in the hands of the United States in its strategic negotiations with Russia. This force is also needed for anti-IS attacks against Raqqa and Deir ez-Zor. Ankara and Riyadh are impatiently awaiting US approval to attack IS, which will open the gates of Syria to them."
Read more: http://www.al-monitor.com/pulse/origina ... z40xiVdYkl
The other option is to shell forces supported by Russian air in the West and US air in the East... where would that leave Turkey? The other main actors are Assad-Iran-Hezbollah (acting as one) and IS (with a lesser Al Qaida aligned supporting wing). So Turkey would be acting against all others involved except IS et al... not a good place to be in?
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)
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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: Turkish Armed Forces
Relating to the above referenced development, here's some more general background to cobbling together such federated airforce:
"“Everyone knows which bloc they more or less belong to today. This is also the basis for collective security. The AKP allowed Turkey to drift away from the West but failed to find a new port for itself. It asked to be admitted to the Shanghai [Russia-China] Cooperation Organization but failed. Today it is isolated and does not know where it belongs. There are signs that it is trying to return to the Western fold, but even that is tentative,” Ozulker said.
Retired Ambassador Temel Iskit also said the AKP’s principal mistake was to move Turkey away from its traditional foreign policy.
“The vision it tried to replace this with was ideologically based and leaned heavily on a Sunni worldview. It assumed that Turkey could be the regional Sunni leader, which was not only out of tune with Turkey’s traditional policies, but also not realistic,”
Read more: http://www.al-monitor.com/pulse/origina ... z41AQyS16G
"“Everyone knows which bloc they more or less belong to today. This is also the basis for collective security. The AKP allowed Turkey to drift away from the West but failed to find a new port for itself. It asked to be admitted to the Shanghai [Russia-China] Cooperation Organization but failed. Today it is isolated and does not know where it belongs. There are signs that it is trying to return to the Western fold, but even that is tentative,” Ozulker said.
Retired Ambassador Temel Iskit also said the AKP’s principal mistake was to move Turkey away from its traditional foreign policy.
“The vision it tried to replace this with was ideologically based and leaned heavily on a Sunni worldview. It assumed that Turkey could be the regional Sunni leader, which was not only out of tune with Turkey’s traditional policies, but also not realistic,”
Read more: http://www.al-monitor.com/pulse/origina ... z41AQyS16G
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)
Re: Turkish Armed Forces
Turkey Started the Construction of its future LHD TCG Anadolu
http://www.navyrecognition.com/index.ph ... ew&id=3907Turkey began the construction of its first LHD / amphibious assault ship on Saturday, April 30th. The first steel cut ceremony was held at Sedef shipyard in Tuzlay Bay close to Istanbul. During the ceremony President of Turkish Republic Recep Tayyip Erdogan declared that "TCG Anadolu will be the first ship in the navy from which F-35B SVTOL planes will operate".
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The Armchair Soldier
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Re: Turkish Armed Forces
A Turkish Cobra has been shot down over Syria by the PKK (at around 4:45):
A Turkish drone and a Chinook were also shot down by the PKK in the last 48 hours.
A Turkish drone and a Chinook were also shot down by the PKK in the last 48 hours.
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Galloglass
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Re: Turkish Armed Forces
The UN is seeking to investigate the murder of hundreds of Kurdish civilians by Turkish army in it's latest attempt to suppress the PKK. At some stage "morality" will have to be invoked when other NATO members get around to commentating on this type of activity. Should be a great help in their application to join the EU.
Re: Turkish Armed Forces
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Re: Turkish Armed Forces
If not investigated as a potential E.U member what about as a member of the N.A.T.O alliance ,is there oversight of the members engaged in potential war crimes ?
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Galloglass
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Re: Turkish Armed Forces
Well NATO and "Others" have been undermining the UN for decades by the use of their various "Vetoes".....There is an arguable case for the removal of ALL vetoes from everybody. if you don't like it then leave like Japan left the League of Nations. Leave those countries with an actual committment to UN principles to take on the task of preventing wars etc do their best to lead the world away from competing "Power Blocs" and competing Corporate interests.
The UN authority is essentially moral ... An authority it looses when "interests" of military blocs are transparently affecting it's ability to function properly.
The UN authority is essentially moral ... An authority it looses when "interests" of military blocs are transparently affecting it's ability to function properly.
Re: Turkish Armed Forces
I'd worry that the removal of vetoes under a one member one vote system would actually reinforce the power bloc structures because it would require the likes of the US, China and Russia to establish voting blocs with other counties in order to pursue their agendas.Galloglass wrote:Well NATO and "Others" have been undermining the UN for decades by the use of their various "Vetoes".....There is an arguable case for the removal of ALL vetoes from everybody. if you don't like it then leave like Japan left the League of Nations. Leave those countries with an actual committment to UN principles to take on the task of preventing wars etc do their best to lead the world away from competing "Power Blocs" and competing Corporate interests.
The UN authority is essentially moral ... An authority it looses when "interests" of military blocs are transparently affecting it's ability to function properly.
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Galloglass
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Re: Turkish Armed Forces
That is politics Pseudo....Better than having a veto in your back pocket as of right.
Have a look at this link which I "Googled" just now. https://www.rt.com/usa/316553-chomsky-un-us-veto/
Have a look at this link which I "Googled" just now. https://www.rt.com/usa/316553-chomsky-un-us-veto/
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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: Turkish Armed Forces
Eurovision song contest, to the power of two?Pseudo wrote:a one member one vote system would actually reinforce the power bloc structures because it would require the likes of the US, China and Russia to establish voting blocs with other counties in order to pursue their agendas.
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)