UK Shipbuilding
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Re: UK Shipbuilding
Depends what the MRSS turns out to be. Who knows, they could even be the amphibious. equivalent of “through-deck cruisers”!
Re: UK Shipbuilding
More like the following (plus a small hanger)Scimitar54 wrote: ↑13 Apr 2022, 04:56 Depends what the MRSS turns out to be. Who knows, they could even be the amphibious. equivalent of “through-deck cruisers”!
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Re: UK Shipbuilding
What is the split between (NO) hangar and extra bunking in the conceptual drawing linked?Repulse wrote: ↑13 Apr 2022, 08:02More like the following (plus a small hanger)Scimitar54 wrote: ↑13 Apr 2022, 04:56 Depends what the MRSS turns out to be. Who knows, they could even be the amphibious. equivalent of “through-deck cruisers”!
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Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)
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Re: UK Shipbuilding
In the amphib thread I had linked the Damen portfolio of smaller LPD and noted some practical examples of smaller LPD in service. For the MRSS I believe they need to be large enough to carry a reiforced RM Company, i.e. a full Company of RM Commandos plus support Platoons / Troops providing artillery support, logistics, signals and communications, engineering and transport etc.ArmChairCivvy wrote: ↑21 May 2022, 15:23What is the split between (NO) hangar and extra bunking in the conceptual drawing linked?Repulse wrote: ↑13 Apr 2022, 08:02More like the following (plus a small hanger)Scimitar54 wrote: ↑13 Apr 2022, 04:56 Depends what the MRSS turns out to be. Who knows, they could even be the amphibious. equivalent of “through-deck cruisers”!
Under Future Commando Force, being able to deploy a RM Company is the limit which we can cover globally. Together with smaller RM Troops being deployed on board OPV and esscorts when required.
Re the future MRSS, I am guessing they will need to have hangar space for at least a couple of helicopters (I am presuming probably Merlin size or smaller), a flight deck with one landing spot big enough to take a Chinook, well deck big enough to carry an LCU and maybe a couple of LCVP on davits. Long term the well deck and flight deck might be mainly used for USV / USuV and UAV. Armanent probably just automated 40mm/30mm cannon with secondary manual HMG / Miniguns.
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Re: UK Shipbuilding
I think the LCU would blow out the cost (size) envelope?wargame_insomniac wrote: ↑21 May 2022, 16:39 Under Future Commando Force, being able to deploy a RM Company is the limit which we can cover globally. Together with smaller RM Troops being deployed on board OPV and esscorts when required.
Re the future MRSS, I am guessing they will need to have hangar space for at least a couple of helicopters (I am presuming probably Merlin size or smaller), a flight deck with one landing spot big enough to take a Chinook, well deck big enough to carry an LCU and maybe a couple of LCVP on davits.
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)
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Re: UK Shipbuilding
Since my comment, have read from the US(N/ MC) budget that they will order their 'nimble' ship in the coming fiscal year
... will be interesting to see how it will map onto our planned 'capabilities'. Namely, Berger (****) before being nominated to the Commandant post was saying that they can learn from the RM 'company-level deployment plans'
... will be interesting to see how it will map onto our planned 'capabilities'. Namely, Berger (****) before being nominated to the Commandant post was saying that they can learn from the RM 'company-level deployment plans'
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)
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Re: UK Shipbuilding
Not the best of news,
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/20 ... p-project/
“Harland & Wolff Shipyard building dock
The historic shipyard that built the Titanic has been forced to delay and cancel a string of key contracts in an update that sent shares plunging by a fifth.
Harland & Wolff, which owns the Belfast yard that built the White Star Line vessel, said that a key military contract to overhaul a minesweeper for the Lithuanian Navy had been delayed by parts shortages.
Cruise and ferry work will also be pushed to 2023, meaning a total of up to £30m of income expected this year will now arrive late.
In addition, a £5m contract to deliver four wind turbine generator jackets has been scrapped.
Harland & Wolff had hoped to earn revenues of between £65m and £75m but said it was now on track to make less than half of that.
Shares slumped by 22pc on the update. The company’s £22m debt pile means it must stay on top of income in order to pay the interest.
The shipbuilder has suffered a number of setbacks this year, including a row with HM Revenue & Customs and the scrapping of plans to build a new Royal yacht nicknamed “Britain’s Air Force One”. Harland was one of two final bidders on the project.
Harland blamed inflation and the poor outlook for the economy for delays to its cruise and ferry work.
Problems obtaining parts for warships have slowed down its contract with the Lithuanian Navy, though it said it should still deliver the ship on time.
John Wood, group chief executive, said: “Whilst it is disappointing that we have not met our aspirations for 2022 due to timing issues, we have made significant progress over the last twelve months.
He added: “I believe that we are now at the cusp of a major transformation of the entire group and the team is working hard to convert bids into contracts.”
Harland picked up a number of contracts this year that stoked hopes of a recovery for British shipbuilding. Shares rallied strongly in November after the company won part of a contract to build Royal Navy supply ships.
However, it has slumped 15pc across 2022 amid lingering concerns about the company’s debts.
HMRC petitioned to have the company wound up for the second time this year in June over an alleged unpaid bill of £92,275.
The company insisted that the most recent legal claim was made in error. The taxman, however, said it took action “where appropriate”.
Harland took steps to refinance its debt in November, moving from more than 12pc interest to cheaper but undisclosed terms.
In November it was part of a consortium including Spanish shipbuilder Navatia that won a £1.6bn contract to build three Royal Navy supply ships.
Up to 60pc of the work would be done in Britain, the company said, although the Government only committed to “the majority” of the shipbuild being done in the UK.
Harland was last awarded a Ministry of Defence contract to build a military boat in 1986. RFA Fort Victoria, a fleet tanker, was announced in 1990 and completed in 1994.”
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/20 ... p-project/
“Harland & Wolff Shipyard building dock
The historic shipyard that built the Titanic has been forced to delay and cancel a string of key contracts in an update that sent shares plunging by a fifth.
Harland & Wolff, which owns the Belfast yard that built the White Star Line vessel, said that a key military contract to overhaul a minesweeper for the Lithuanian Navy had been delayed by parts shortages.
Cruise and ferry work will also be pushed to 2023, meaning a total of up to £30m of income expected this year will now arrive late.
In addition, a £5m contract to deliver four wind turbine generator jackets has been scrapped.
Harland & Wolff had hoped to earn revenues of between £65m and £75m but said it was now on track to make less than half of that.
Shares slumped by 22pc on the update. The company’s £22m debt pile means it must stay on top of income in order to pay the interest.
The shipbuilder has suffered a number of setbacks this year, including a row with HM Revenue & Customs and the scrapping of plans to build a new Royal yacht nicknamed “Britain’s Air Force One”. Harland was one of two final bidders on the project.
Harland blamed inflation and the poor outlook for the economy for delays to its cruise and ferry work.
Problems obtaining parts for warships have slowed down its contract with the Lithuanian Navy, though it said it should still deliver the ship on time.
John Wood, group chief executive, said: “Whilst it is disappointing that we have not met our aspirations for 2022 due to timing issues, we have made significant progress over the last twelve months.
He added: “I believe that we are now at the cusp of a major transformation of the entire group and the team is working hard to convert bids into contracts.”
Harland picked up a number of contracts this year that stoked hopes of a recovery for British shipbuilding. Shares rallied strongly in November after the company won part of a contract to build Royal Navy supply ships.
However, it has slumped 15pc across 2022 amid lingering concerns about the company’s debts.
HMRC petitioned to have the company wound up for the second time this year in June over an alleged unpaid bill of £92,275.
The company insisted that the most recent legal claim was made in error. The taxman, however, said it took action “where appropriate”.
Harland took steps to refinance its debt in November, moving from more than 12pc interest to cheaper but undisclosed terms.
In November it was part of a consortium including Spanish shipbuilder Navatia that won a £1.6bn contract to build three Royal Navy supply ships.
Up to 60pc of the work would be done in Britain, the company said, although the Government only committed to “the majority” of the shipbuild being done in the UK.
Harland was last awarded a Ministry of Defence contract to build a military boat in 1986. RFA Fort Victoria, a fleet tanker, was announced in 1990 and completed in 1994.”
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Re: UK Shipbuilding
Further progress - I hope they can get a move on now, as apparently the new covered Shipbuilding Hall needs to be finished for starting the 4th T26, HMS London, the first of Batch 2. Although I guess there is nothing stoppping them to start London in the existing SBOH and then moving it when the new Hall is ready.
https://ukdefencejournal.org.uk/huge-gl ... n-granted/
I do hope that the T83 is not expected to be more than 170 metres long.....
https://ukdefencejournal.org.uk/huge-gl ... n-granted/
I do hope that the T83 is not expected to be more than 170 metres long.....
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Re: UK Shipbuilding
There is 30m of quay in front of the new assembly hall, 18m behind. Plus a further 80 odd meters of misc. sheds between the NAH and the Govan Road.wargame_insomniac wrote: ↑12 Feb 2023, 18:09
I do hope that the T83 is not expected to be more than 170 metres long.....
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Re: UK Shipbuilding
Not much new here but still an ongoing commitment from HMG to the T32 programme as well increasing overall Frigate and Destroyer numbers.
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Re: UK Shipbuilding
Although it will get zero fanfare this could be a pretty important development.
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/new- ... ommunities
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/new- ... ommunities
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Re: UK Shipbuilding
A useful contract whilst preparations scale up for FSS.
https://www.harland-wolff.com/news/belf ... rbishment/
https://www.harland-wolff.com/news/belf ... rbishment/
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Re: UK Shipbuilding
I thought that the BMT design was already selected and in build? Anyone? When I went on the Sicilian it was the model on display.
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Re: UK Shipbuilding
This is still progressing apparently.
3 ships?
Hull one @£150m, hulls two & three “significantly less”. All to be built in UK yards.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/20 ... tor-three/
https://britanniamaritimeaid.com/
3 ships?
Hull one @£150m, hulls two & three “significantly less”. All to be built in UK yards.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/20 ... tor-three/
https://britanniamaritimeaid.com/
Re: UK Shipbuilding
Not quite sure what this has to do with a "Royal Yacht".Poiuytrewq wrote: ↑13 Sep 2023, 07:45 This is still progressing apparently.
3 ships?
Hull one @£150m, hulls two & three “significantly less”. All to be built in UK yards.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/20 ... tor-three/
https://britanniamaritimeaid.com/
The "UKAID ship" concept was more closely related to the idea of a UK hospital ship than Brittania II (both good ideas which should be financed out of the aid budget)
Have they added a VVIP cabin or something?
Edit: For clarity - I'm saying that the UKAID & hospital ships were "both good ideas". Not the Royal Yacht
I'm fine with a Royal Yacht being built (say, by public donation and not from tax money), but not much point if the Royals don't want it
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Re: UK Shipbuilding
The connection with the Royal Yacht is not clear. I suspect it’s more of a symbolic replacement.Caribbean wrote: ↑13 Sep 2023, 08:52 Not quite sure what this has to do with a "Royal Yacht".
The "UKAID ship" concept was more closely related to the idea of a UK hospital ship than Brittania II (both good ideas which should be financed out of the aid budget)
Have they added a VVIP cabin or something?
Three vessels is very ambitious but if operated by a charity they should qualify for for funding through FCDO.
It would be great to see a bit more detail about the design and what medical facilities these vessels actually contain. The shape of the stern looks particularly interesting
A British success story waiting to happen.
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Re: UK Shipbuilding
On the balance of probability….don’t hold your breath.
Saying that, with a change of government, who knows.
Re: UK Shipbuilding
A 135m design by Leadship. Shares lineage with their World Explorer Polar Cruise Ship.
It's project number is P19004.11 which follows on from a 135m ROPAX Ferry for Cammel Laird "Project Mona" P19004.10
https://www.leadship.com/blank
It's project number is P19004.11 which follows on from a 135m ROPAX Ferry for Cammel Laird "Project Mona" P19004.10
https://www.leadship.com/blank
Re: UK Shipbuilding
Privately funded so not sure what effect a change of government has.Poiuytrewq wrote: ↑13 Sep 2023, 18:43On the balance of probability….don’t hold your breath.
Saying that, with a change of government, who knows.
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Re: UK Shipbuilding
I think the idea of a new Royal Yacht is an awful idea. I think the idea of UK Aid ship, especially one funded by Foriegn and Commonwealth Office aid budget, is a great idea.
Especially if good sized hospital and able to take the burden of covering HADR from the lncreasingly stretched escort and ageing out group.
Especially if good sized hospital and able to take the burden of covering HADR from the lncreasingly stretched escort and ageing out group.