U.K. UAV's/Drones

Contains threads on Joint Service equipment of the past, present and future.
Post Reply
User avatar
ArmChairCivvy
Senior Member
Posts: 16312
Joined: 05 May 2015, 21:34
United Kingdom

Re: U.K. UAV's/Drones

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

The ones around Gatwick must be UK drones (as they are flying in the UK airspace)
... and here folks that have gone "hunting them" are pictured ( with shotguns :) ) https://e3.365dm.com/18/12/1096x616/sky ... 1220121425
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)

User avatar
SKB
Senior Member
Posts: 7931
Joined: 30 Apr 2015, 18:35
England

Re: U.K. UAV's/Drones

Post by SKB »

I say ban them all to those without a pilots licence. They don't allow people to drive cars on the ground without a drivers licence.

NickC
Donator
Posts: 1432
Joined: 01 Sep 2017, 14:20
United Kingdom

Re: U.K. UAV's/Drones

Post by NickC »

Found a use for the T26 mission bay to give them some firepower, load up with Narco sem-submeribles, replace the 1t cocaine with HE, add AI navigation, radio and sensor :angel:
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

Caribbean
Senior Member
Posts: 2784
Joined: 09 Jan 2016, 19:08
United Kingdom

Re: U.K. UAV's/Drones

Post by Caribbean »

SKB wrote:I say ban them all to those without a pilots licence. They don't allow people to drive cars on the ground with a drivers licence.
Anything over 20 kg (IIRC) needs a drone pilots licence at the moment. The aircraft needs to be registered as well
The pessimist sees difficulty in every opportunity. The optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty.
Winston Churchill

RetroSicotte
Retired Site Admin
Posts: 2657
Joined: 30 Apr 2015, 18:10
United Kingdom

Re: U.K. UAV's/Drones

Post by RetroSicotte »

Got to question whether it might be cheaper to just have a permanent counter-drone presence at airports.

Can guarantee you that a whole year's budget to do this for every airport in the country woulda probably been cheaper than the cost incurred by what just happened in 48 hours.

Government could take a long look at this when they consider the defence budget. These two drones just demonstrated on a small scale what happens when you don't fund defence properly, and then allow the consequences to happen.

It always costs more to take the risk. Always.

User avatar
ArmChairCivvy
Senior Member
Posts: 16312
Joined: 05 May 2015, 21:34
United Kingdom

Re: U.K. UAV's/Drones

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

RetroSicotte wrote: have a permanent counter-drone presence at airports.
Yes, why not. As it does not have to be like the ones fielded on army manoeuvres (dealing with swarms/ dealing with dozens of targets in quick succession). Something like this; could be flown by the air traffic controllers
"The Blighter Anti-UAV (unmanned aerial vehicle) Defense System (AUDS) scans the skies for drones, tracks their movements, then jams the radio control signals that keep them flying. After locking onto the target, the system focuses a high-powered radio signal at it, breaking the connection between drone and driver.

Blighter Surveillance Systems makes the Ku-band radar element that detects the UAVs within 5 miles. Chess Dynamics makes the camera that tracks their movements. Enterprise Control Systems, Ltd. makes the directional radio frequency inhibitor that takes them out of the sky."

The proposal from the pilots union was to extend the airport "drone exclusion zone" from 1 km out to 5 km.
- so one of these (in the air, so probs two needed) could secure/ detect pretty much out to that kind of "perimeter"
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)

Phil Sayers
Member
Posts: 365
Joined: 03 May 2015, 13:56

Re: U.K. UAV's/Drones

Post by Phil Sayers »

I might need to reach for a tinfoil hat and obviously there are numerous other possibilities (with the most likely simply being someone gets their jollies from ruining other people's Christmas jollies) but I can't help thinking that there is a country which is plenty angry at the UK, views causing disruption and economic cost as forming part of hybrid warfare, might wish to demonstrate that despite having intelligence agents deported they retain the ability to act with impunity within the UK, could easily carry out untraceable modifications to enable commercial drones to fly for longer, possibly be able to mask where the signal comes from and has been having its own problems with waves of modified drones flying towards an airbase.....

Scimitar54
Senior Member
Posts: 1701
Joined: 13 Jul 2015, 05:10
United Kingdom

Re: U.K. UAV's/Drones

Post by Scimitar54 »

Make ownership and operation punishable by death :mrgreen:

User avatar
ArmChairCivvy
Senior Member
Posts: 16312
Joined: 05 May 2015, 21:34
United Kingdom

Re: U.K. UAV's/Drones

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

Phil Sayers wrote:be able to mask where the signal comes from
That's why 'zapping' it at the receiving end is the easiest solution?
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)

Phil Sayers
Member
Posts: 365
Joined: 03 May 2015, 13:56

Re: U.K. UAV's/Drones

Post by Phil Sayers »

ArmChairCivvy wrote:
Phil Sayers wrote:be able to mask where the signal comes from
That's why 'zapping' it at the receiving end is the easiest solution?
I don't know anything about how drones and their signals actually work so could be completely wrong but I would be surprised if the signal controlling a standard toy or commercial drone in the air couldn't be easily traced back to the operator. That whoever is behind this has been able to make multiple flights without that happening is part of what is making me suspicious about whether it is just a 'normal' drone being used.

User avatar
ArmChairCivvy
Senior Member
Posts: 16312
Joined: 05 May 2015, 21:34
United Kingdom

Re: U.K. UAV's/Drones

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

Phil Sayers wrote:would be surprised if the signal controlling a standard toy or commercial drone in the air couldn't be easily traced back to the operator
Constant frequency hopping (in controlling the 'non-std' ones) is a good trick. In this 18 sec footage the signal was so strong, however, that as the attack helos passed, weapon release for their rockets happened, as it happened to be one of the frequencies
- and by coincidence they were coming straight at the control station (and fired on it)
- and through another coincidence, someone was completely oblivious to the fact that he was standing next to the control station (truck) and the footage was released on the internet
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/ ... -war-games

Now we know why they do so much EMC testing with everything that goes on carriers
... if there is an accidental weapon release, there might be another loaded plane/ helo in the way, and off goes the chain reaction
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)

User avatar
SKB
Senior Member
Posts: 7931
Joined: 30 Apr 2015, 18:35
England

Re: U.K. UAV's/Drones

Post by SKB »

Why are there no pictures or videos of this drone at Gatwick, which has now been flying around for more than 24 hours and appeared "over fifty times" according to the BBC ?

RetroSicotte
Retired Site Admin
Posts: 2657
Joined: 30 Apr 2015, 18:10
United Kingdom

Re: U.K. UAV's/Drones

Post by RetroSicotte »

SKB wrote:Why are there no pictures or videos of this drone at Gatwick, which has now been flying around for more than 24 hours and appeared "over fifty times" according to the BBC ?
Where's the footage going to come from? It's an airport's extended grounds and airspace, not exactly covered in public footage.

User avatar
SKB
Senior Member
Posts: 7931
Joined: 30 Apr 2015, 18:35
England

Re: U.K. UAV's/Drones

Post by SKB »

Footage could be obtained from the airport's perimeter security cameras, from passengers inside the terminal buildings, from the nearby hotels, from the town of Crawley to the immediate south, from the town of Horley to the immediate north, from the A23 dual carriageway to the airports east perimeter, from the mainline London-Brighton railway which has a station attached to the South Terminal. Or from planespotters camped at the airport's rural western edge near to the village of Charlwood.

Gatwick is the UK's second biggest airport, its sandwiched between two towns and the busy London-Brighton transport routes. There are cameras literally EVERYWHERE. I find it strange that not a single image or video of a drone have been shared so far.

Mercator
Member
Posts: 669
Joined: 06 May 2015, 02:10
Contact:
Australia

Re: U.K. UAV's/Drones

Post by Mercator »

I don't imagine many point into the sky. And members of the public were discouraged from going outside the terminals to look for them.

It's hardly a conspiracy mate.

User avatar
ArmChairCivvy
Senior Member
Posts: 16312
Joined: 05 May 2015, 21:34
United Kingdom

Re: U.K. UAV's/Drones

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

Those shot guns (in the footage :) ) must be pointed well away from the runways
... or what's left on the grounds could end up sucked into the jet turbines; round bits, but hard!

And Santa had let it be known that he will soon have to start his own travels, so that set the priorities :) : "service resumes

The first flight after 32 hours of drone disruption left for Lapland "
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)

RunningStrong
Senior Member
Posts: 1304
Joined: 06 May 2015, 20:52

Re: U.K. UAV's/Drones

Post by RunningStrong »

Phil Sayers wrote:
ArmChairCivvy wrote:
Phil Sayers wrote:be able to mask where the signal comes from
That's why 'zapping' it at the receiving end is the easiest solution?
I don't know anything about how drones and their signals actually work so could be completely wrong but I would be surprised if the signal controlling a standard toy or commercial drone in the air couldn't be easily traced back to the operator. That whoever is behind this has been able to make multiple flights without that happening is part of what is making me suspicious about whether it is just a 'normal' drone being used.
It doesn't necessarily need a signal. Set to fly a predetermined route using waypoints and inertial navigation, it can operate without control signals or GPS, atleast within the easily navigated confines of an airfield.

User avatar
ArmChairCivvy
Senior Member
Posts: 16312
Joined: 05 May 2015, 21:34
United Kingdom

Re: U.K. UAV's/Drones

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

Yes, autonomy in that sort of pre-programmed way
... and AI making its way to here, too

So far, weapon release (they didn't have any) reserved for the humans
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)

Qwerty
Member
Posts: 109
Joined: 06 Apr 2018, 15:36
Germany

Re: U.K. UAV's/Drones

Post by Qwerty »

Made me chuckle
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

RetroSicotte
Retired Site Admin
Posts: 2657
Joined: 30 Apr 2015, 18:10
United Kingdom

Re: U.K. UAV's/Drones

Post by RetroSicotte »

SKB wrote:Footage could be obtained from the airport's perimeter security cameras
Yes, I'm sure that Gatwick security's prime priority right now is editing and releasing footage from cameras for the entertainment of the public.
from passengers inside the terminal buildings, from the nearby hotels, from the town of Crawley to the immediate south, from the town of Horley to the immediate north, from the A23 dual carriageway to the airports east perimeter, from the mainline London-Brighton railway which has a station attached to the South Terminal. Or from planespotters camped at the airport's rural western edge near to the village of Charlwood.
Most of the approaches since people knew to actually look for them have been at night. There's a couple videos only now lurking around. But it's no surprise there's not a lot of sightings when it's in areas the public generally aren't, at night, being very small, in an area now crammed with helicopters and their own lights and sounds in sky.
Gatwick is the UK's second biggest airport
Making it very clear why it's not as common to see it. Gatwick is gigantic.
There are cameras literally EVERYWHERE. I find it strange that not a single image or video of a drone have been shared so far.
Go look at the cameras. Go look at their default arc. It's at the ground.

topman
Member
Posts: 771
Joined: 07 May 2015, 20:56
Tokelau

Re: U.K. UAV's/Drones

Post by topman »

And closed again, more drone sightings.

User avatar
SKB
Senior Member
Posts: 7931
Joined: 30 Apr 2015, 18:35
England

Re: U.K. UAV's/Drones

Post by SKB »


https://news.sussex.police.uk/news/two- ... cialSignIn

A 47-year-old man and 54-year-old woman from Crawley are being questioned in connection with multiple drone sightings that brought Gatwick Airport to a standstill.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-46658868

User avatar
SKB
Senior Member
Posts: 7931
Joined: 30 Apr 2015, 18:35
England

Re: U.K. UAV's/Drones

Post by SKB »


Sussex Police statement:
Two people arrested in conjunction with the widespread disruption of flights at Gatwick Airport through the illegal use of drones have been released without charge on Sunday (23 December).

Sussex Police Detective Chief Superintendent Jason Tingley said: “Both people have fully co-operated with our enquiries and I am satisfied that they are no longer suspects in the drone incidents at Gatwick.

“It is important to remember that when people are arrested in an effort to make further enquiries it does not mean that they are guilty of an offence and Sussex Police would not seek to make their identity public.

“Our inquiry continues at a pace to locate those responsible for the drone incursions, and we continue to actively follow lines of investigation.

“We ask for the public’s continued support by reporting anything suspicious, contacting us with any information in relation to the drone incidents at Gatwick."

Gatwick Airport Limited has offered a £50,000 reward through Crimestoppers, for information leading to the arrest and conviction of those responsible for the criminal act that disrupted flights.

If you have any information please contact Crimestoppers 100% anonymously on 0800 555 111 or through their anonymous online form at Crimestoppers website. Payout on the reward will be made only if the information is given to Crimestoppers first.

User avatar
SKB
Senior Member
Posts: 7931
Joined: 30 Apr 2015, 18:35
England

Re: U.K. UAV's/Drones

Post by SKB »

So, who's brave enough to admit "I got a drone for Christmas!" first ? :mrgreen:

User avatar
Pseudo
Senior Member
Posts: 1732
Joined: 30 Apr 2015, 21:37
Tuvalu

Re: U.K. UAV's/Drones

Post by Pseudo »

SKB wrote:So, who's brave enough to admit "I got a drone for Christmas!" first ? :mrgreen:
Or more importantly, who's brave enough to admit that they lost their drone a few days before Christmas somewhere in the vicinity of Gatwick? :mrgreen:

Post Reply