Sea Ceptor and a 5" gun is as much can be hoped for And what use is that for stopping our F35's from getting wet? There are very real threats to our carriers from on the water, under the water, in the air and on the ground. An escort needs to be able to protect againt all these threats, or it ...

I think VLS is a must have for a modern ship. With them you can fill them with anti-surface, anti-sub, anti-air and land attack missiles giving it a full spectrum capability to protect things, the entire point of an escort. It may not have the sensors onboard to self designate targets, but more cap...

If the primary purpose of the T45 and T26 is to protect the carrier task force, why would only one-third of them be available at any one time? Historically that's what you get. Official stats on the T45, for the period April 2012-April 2015, give operational availability percentages ranging from 47...

@Tony Williams I really don't think 8 T26's and 6 T-45's is enough to protect a carrier taskforce. Only third would be available so best case would be 2 T-45 & 3 T-26. To protect not just the carrier (no missile self defense) but also the RFA train trailing behind (say a couple of Tides plus a ...

Just by removing the lift fan you would increase the range, its big heavyweight kit. I hope that is being considered for RAF operations, increased range and decreased maintenance, great! Then if they they could put a fuel tank in its place, even better. That would be a great design. It might - but ...

the elephant in the room is manpower. By postponing 5 frigates the Government solves manpower problems in the medium term as could see the Type 23 fleet run down to 8 vessels before t26 appears to crew the carriers. Not according to the SDSR: "We will maintain our fleet of 19 frigates and dest...

Prefer the Dave A to the C, for the RAF, as the latter is optimised for carrier ops. So was the F-4 Phantom II, the Buccaneer and the FA-18. Didn't stop them from being successful warplanes when land-based. The C has the advantage of a longer range and a refuelling system compatible with the Britis...

Yes what happens when the 2nd rate Frigate has to be bounced into a conflict because there are no other vessels available or its lower threat patrol area throws up a high threat at short notice. A light frigate available in theatre, armed with Sea Ceptor, a Wildcat helo and a 127mm gun with PG ammo...

Little J wrote:Or you could just buy the dave c instead, same refuelling system, longer range.

That's not such a daft idea, although it would be politically unacceptable since it would reopen the row about converting the QEs to CTOL.

What the royal navy lacks is escorts, so what ever we have needs to be able to keep up with the rest of the fleet. The core of our future fleet will be two aircraft carriers for which six T45 and eight T26 probably make a satisfactory escort force. Any serious threat will see the carrier force and/...

You mean like one of these marvelous ships? No, I did not mean a massively overpriced and under-equipped speedboat. I think the demand for smaller, shallower-draft vessels is something of a fad, that already seems to be passing. I seriously hope the royal navy wouldn't waste money on such a project...

seaspear wrote:Perhaps a problem being with a lighter less capable figate is finding customers for it .

The French have exported 15 La Fayette light frigates despite only buying five for themselves.

I think a bunch of us here are hung up on your question. I suspect deleting the gas turbine and installing more diesels would save money. So would leaving a big hole where the mk 41 would fit (they are kinda expensive for what they do). Reusing the old gun wouldn't necessarily save money if a bunch...

SKB wrote:Maybe 'light' just means a thinner coat of paint... on a T26.

...or a paler shade of grey?

The Gibraltar squadron craft should replaced two border force cutters clones with a 30 mm gun replacing the fire fighting monitor on the forward deck. I suspect that would take a major rewrite of the purpose and operating principles of the Border Force. The force basically has a police role, and th...

I'm guessing it'll be a brand new original British design. Probably named Type 27 for the UK, but "Global Utility Vessel" (or something equally pretentious!) for the foreign market. If we don't design our own, we're liable to lose the experienced design staff and therefore the capability ...

malcrf wrote:As long as we get 13 T26 I wouldn't mind a few of these:

The SDSR clearly limits the number of T26 to eight. The other five, replacing T23 in the general role, will be lighter and cheaper than T26.

Size by itself is quite cheap to buy and run, and an advantage in open oceans - but not in shallow/confined waters or small ports. The main cost of ships lies in the sensors and weapon systems (plus, in the T26, some complex sound-insulation methods and a gas turbine engine). So the primary question...

This is what the SDSR actually says - it's on the web, here: https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/478933/52309_Cm_9161_NSS_SD_Review_web_only.pdf Type 45 destroyers, Type 23 frigates, Astute Class submarines and Mine Countermeasure Vessels. We will maintain one o...

THE TIMES In an interview with The Sunday Times, the chancellor said Britain should put aside its qualms about military intervention and be prepared to “project our values” around the world. That's a curious phrase. It implies that "project our values" means the ability to bomb the hell o...

shark bait wrote:I hope you aren't seriously suggesting we start chopping up tornados and adding bits!

No - I said starting in around 2000. Far too late now...

One of my daydreams is to imagine a drastic modification to the Tornado, starting in around 2000 (i.e. following on from the adoption of the BAE P.1216 STOVL fighter instead of Typhoon ;) ). The idea being to greatly increase the internal fuel capacity as well as provide an internal weapons bay so t...

The Armchair Soldier wrote:HMS Clyde in South Georiga:

I'm pleased to see the penguin respectfully standing to attention

Another alternative might be "Forked Lightning" but that have to be careful with that, too

If they wanted to emphasise that it was different from the previous Lightnings then they could call it something more specific, such as "Sheet Lightning". They'd have to be careful how that's pronounced, though