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F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

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How do you feel about the F-35B for the RN and RAF? (2 votes per member)

GOOD choice for the Royal Navy
118
44%
BAD choice for the Royal Navy
10
4%
Uncertain (RN)
14
5%
GOOD choice for the Royal Air Force
48
18%
BAD choice for the Royal Air Force
36
14%
Uncertain (RAF)
40
15%
 
Total votes: 266

downsizer
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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby downsizer » 12 Jun 2019, 10:54

Potential hypoxia?

SW1
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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby SW1 » 12 Jun 2019, 12:08

downsizer wrote:Potential hypoxia?


Given there has been a number of incidents of it reported it may well have occurred seem strange to rule on CFiT so definitely.

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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby SW1 » 12 Jun 2019, 12:09

A number of articles now reporting issues surrounding f35s that are making there way public

https://www.defensenews.com/smr/hidden-troubles-f35/

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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby SW1 » 12 Jun 2019, 12:12

Timmymagic wrote:
SW1 wrote:You would think a plane as sophisticated as f35 would have a override to protect the pilot and get to steady level flight like others do.


There aren't any that deploy automatically though, the MiG-29 one was a button press that resulted in a wings level, low rate of climb. But it still needed the pilot to select it. The danger is when the pilot is unaware of the conditions.


Typhoon has a auto recovery if the pilot doesn’t respond to inputs after 3 sec of warnings a very low speed depending on the regime this a/c was in it may not be applicable.

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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby Timmymagic » 16 Jun 2019, 21:54

SW1 wrote:A number of articles now reporting issues surrounding f35s that are making there way public

https://www.defensenews.com/smr/hidden-troubles-f35/


Lockheed have come out with some answers to the list of issues. Looks like the supersonic issue on B's and C's will affect practically none of the UK's fleet, and on the aircraft from before Lot 8 there is a tiny chance of it ever occurring.

https://www.f35.com/news/detail/lockhee ... -reporting

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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby SW1 » 16 Jun 2019, 22:27

Timmymagic wrote:
SW1 wrote:A number of articles now reporting issues surrounding f35s that are making there way public

https://www.defensenews.com/smr/hidden-troubles-f35/


Lockheed have come out with some answers to the list of issues. Looks like the supersonic issue on B's and C's will affect practically none of the UK's fleet, and on the aircraft from before Lot 8 there is a tiny chance of it ever occurring.

https://www.f35.com/news/detail/lockhee ... -reporting


That answer was already covered within the article,

“Vice Adm. Mat Winter, who leads the F-35 program on behalf of the Pentagon, told Defense News that the department has taken steps to mitigate the problem with an improved spray-on coating, but added that the government will not completely fix it — instead accepting additional risk.
The new coating, which was introduced in Lot 8, allows the jet to withstand hotter temperatures caused by the afterburner, the documents stated. Winter characterized the material as able to withstand “what we call the thermal shock wave,” but declined to specify how the coating works or how much protection it provides.

“It may be some future advanced materials that can withstand the pressure and the temperature,” Winter said. “Then we see that, and we go, ‘Hey, look, we've got this on the book,’ [and] we do a test check to see if that new material solves that problem.”

The Defense Department has also instituted time limits on the number of seconds the F-35B and F-35C can fly at speeds in excess of Mach 1.2 while at full afterburner.“


So the solution is mitigation in place with increase risk accepted. It will affect ALL f35b until some future yet to be developed material is available and tested.

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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby Timmymagic » 17 Jun 2019, 10:20

\Nothing we didn't know, Asraam CSP, Spear and Meteor for Block 4.

Worryingly though Lockheed don't appear to know what a JSM looks like...


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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby Timmymagic » 17 Jun 2019, 10:45

Some good news for F-35 (and the UK). Looks like it will get even cheaper at FRP when the majority of UK orders will go in. Sounds like F-35B is on course to go under $100m, probably closer to $90-95m when we get to FRP.


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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby dmereifield » 17 Jun 2019, 15:20

Timmymagic wrote:Some good news for F-35 (and the UK). Looks like it will get even cheaper at FRP when the majority of UK orders will go in. Sounds like F-35B is on course to go under $100m, probably closer to $90-95m when we get to FRP.



Are you sure? That's without the engines presumably?

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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby Jdam » 17 Jun 2019, 20:15

Timmymagic wrote:\Nothing we didn't know, Asraam CSP, Spear and Meteor for Block 4.



4 or 6 meteors internally I wonder :think:

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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby Timmymagic » 18 Jun 2019, 17:25

dmereifield wrote:Are you sure? That's without the engines presumably?


Flyaway apparently (engine included)...It looks like the F-35B carries a c$20m premium over the F-35A (at least it has on the recent lots).

Lockheed are also saying that they're still aiming for $25,000 per flight hour in 2025 (obviously this will be a little higher for F-35B). If they can actually hit that its incredible (and there is some doubt that they can).

https://www.defensenews.com/air/2019/06 ... iyear-buy/

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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby dmereifield » 18 Jun 2019, 21:35

Timmymagic wrote:
dmereifield wrote:Are you sure? That's without the engines presumably?


Flyaway apparently (engine included)...It looks like the F-35B carries a c$20m premium over the F-35A (at least it has on the recent lots).

Lockheed are also saying that they're still aiming for $25,000 per flight hour in 2025 (obviously this will be a little higher for F-35B). If they can actually hit that its incredible (and there is some doubt that they can).

https://www.defensenews.com/air/2019/06 ... iyear-buy/


Thanks

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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby Timmymagic » 18 Jun 2019, 22:47

Jdam wrote:4 or 6 meteors internally I wonder


It's a good point, dimensionally there is no reason why the clipped wing Meteor that will be used on F-35 couldn't be mounted like the proposed Amraam arrangement. What would be even better is if there was a way to mount 2 x Asraam on the doors and have them as drop launched (perhaps with powered rams like F.3) for 4 x Meteor and 4 x Asraam CSP internally. But 4 Meteor, 2 Asraam on outer wing pylon and (god willing) CFT's, 2 x 460 gallon external tanks and a gun pod (if we ever order any) would be an incredible RN CAP aircraft. Time on station would be incredible.

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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby Aethulwulf » 25 Jun 2019, 01:48

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-48745027

UK F35s,  based in Cyprus, have carried out more than 14 armed reconnaissance missions over Iraq and Syria, the Ministry of Defence says.

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SKB
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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby SKB » 27 Jun 2019, 16:56


(Forces TV) 27 June 2018
The UK's most advanced warplane, the F-35B, has successfully completed its first operational missions. The Lightning jets flew alongside Typhoon aircraft over Iraq and Syria in support of Operation Shader - Britain's contribution to the fight against so-called Islamic State. The first mission took place on 16 June over Syria, with two F-35Bs taking part. Since then, the jets have flown a further 12 sorties from RAF Akrotiri.

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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby Lord Jim » 01 Jul 2019, 02:33

According to Air Force Monthly, the RAF is going to have less aircraft allocated to the F-35 Squadrons (Between 8 and 10) compared to the Typhoon equipped ones. Seems to be another case of smoke and mirrors as the average Joe will only see the number of Squadrons stood up not the number of aircraft available. Now this is supposed to be the number of aircraft airworthy per Squadron thank God otherwise I would be very concerned.

topman
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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby topman » 01 Jul 2019, 06:31

I very much doubt that the average person on the street will have any interest or knowledge at all in the number of a/c per sqn or numbers of sqns in the f35 fleet.

SW1
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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby SW1 » 01 Jul 2019, 09:14

Lord Jim wrote:According to Air Force Monthly, the RAF is going to have less aircraft allocated to the F-35 Squadrons (Between 8 and 10) compared to the Typhoon equipped ones. Seems to be another case of smoke and mirrors as the average Joe will only see the number of Squadrons stood up not the number of aircraft available. Now this is supposed to be the number of aircraft airworthy per Squadron thank God otherwise I would be very concerned.


Always thought 3 of 9 a/c makes fore sense than 2 of 12.

Scimitar54
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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby Scimitar54 » 01 Jul 2019, 14:26

That is only because the one operational Squadron, (617) currently only has 9 aircraft (the average of 8 and 10). ***p journalism is obviously not just confined to the tabloids.

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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby Timmymagic » 01 Jul 2019, 18:35



Quickly followed by...presumably just the 2 of them



Interesting flight line at Marham now. These open shelters are a departure for the RAF.


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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby Timmymagic » 01 Jul 2019, 19:23


Lord Jim
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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby Lord Jim » 02 Jul 2019, 13:16

Scimitar54 wrote:That is only because the one operational Squadron, (617) currently only has 9 aircraft (the average of 8 and 10). ***p journalism is obviously not just confined to the tabloids


Don't be so sure, from our initial 48 aircraft we are forming two operational squadrons, an OCU and OEU and have planes in both the fleet management cycle and in storage. However the way aircraft fleets are maintained means the number of aircraft allocated to a squadron means something different from what it one did. In the past we would have say sixteen on a squadron books but say only ten to twelve available with the rest in various levels of maintenance. Going forward with the two step maintenance cycle, the number of planes in a squadron should refer to the number actually available, from a pool of airframes. We won't actually now until more are delivered but I am hoping this is the case.

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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby The Armchair Soldier » 02 Jul 2019, 16:37

Image

Image

Image

Image
RAF F-35 Lightning aircraft from 617 Squadron “The Dambusters” operating today with their Aeronautica Militare counterparts.

Italy and the UK were the first European operators of the 5th generation F-35 to declare Initial Operating Capability, with the Italian Air Force having reached this milestone in November 2018.

Operating with the Aeronautica Militare reaffirms the close relationship the RAF has with the Italian Air Force. In addition to sharing the same aircraft in the F-35, the UK and Italy also fly the Eurofighter Typhoon, with both nations regularly deploying the Typhoon to NATO Air Policing tasks in the Baltic, Iceland and in Romania.

The next stage of the F-35 programme for the UK will be the arrival of 207 Squadron at RAF Marham later this year.

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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby SKB » 12 Jul 2019, 13:08


(Forces TV) 11th July 2019
Four of the RAF’s new F-35B jets have returned to the UK after a two-month exercise in Cyprus. During their time on the island, the Lightnings flew their first operational missions over Iraq and Syria. Just before they left Akrotiri, Simon Newton spoke to the Wing Commander John Butcher, the officer in charge of 617 Squadron, about what it is like to fly the world’s most advanced warplane.

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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby downsizer » 16 Jul 2019, 10:30

207 probably sending some jets back to Marhell later....


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