Tide Class Tankers (MARS) (RFA)
Re: Tide Class Tankers (MARS) (RFA)
What about width? If the ties are at 1.8m, that looks around 8-9m wide at the near end. Maybe 2 Merlin side-by-side?
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Re: Tide Class Tankers (MARS) (RFA)
I agree it is wide. But the 2nd-floor "balcony" looks like prepared for Merlin. So, maybe 1 Merline? Not sure....
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Re: Tide Class Tankers (MARS) (RFA)
I see that Tidesurge has finally reappeared on AIS, waiting to transit the Panama Canal.
Not long now until we have 3x Tides in UK waters...
Not long now until we have 3x Tides in UK waters...
Re: Tide Class Tankers (MARS) (RFA)
I would still vote for two Merlin side by side - if it is only one with a hanger that big its a pretty poor design . How do we know that the tie points are 1.8 metre between? Definitely easily accommodate two Wildcat, even the T45 can do that ....donald_of_tokyo wrote:Looks like 14 points. If true, 25.2 m.
I agree it is wide. But the 2nd-floor "balcony" looks like prepared for Merlin. So, maybe 1 Merline? Not sure....
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Re: Tide Class Tankers (MARS) (RFA)
on a vessel twice the length of our previous pocket-carriers, and twice their displacementPongoglo wrote: if it is only one with a hanger that big its a pretty poor design
- I still think the double-funnel wraparound has something to do with this
- one Merlin for own use; another ferried to work with the Bays (once "in the area")?
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Re: Tide Class Tankers (MARS) (RFA)
I don't know the exact size of the hanger in the Tide class, but the RN requirement was for a hanger large enough to support and maintain 1 merlin.
If the hanger is only big enough for 1 merlin, this is not a fault of the design; the design meets the requirement.
For those who wish for a bigger hanger, all I can say is the RN customer disagrees with you.
It is not just an issue of ship design and construction costs. Manpower, as ever, is key. Does the RN have the personnel required to support 2 Merlins on each Tide, along with those deployed on QEC and elsewhere. If the answer is no, then paying for a bigger hanger is just a waste.
If the hanger is only big enough for 1 merlin, this is not a fault of the design; the design meets the requirement.
For those who wish for a bigger hanger, all I can say is the RN customer disagrees with you.
It is not just an issue of ship design and construction costs. Manpower, as ever, is key. Does the RN have the personnel required to support 2 Merlins on each Tide, along with those deployed on QEC and elsewhere. If the answer is no, then paying for a bigger hanger is just a waste.
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Re: Tide Class Tankers (MARS) (RFA)
More, is it as much required there? As ACC said, they're accompanying ships that carry far more helos than they used to; and not just the carriers. Escorts too.
Re: Tide Class Tankers (MARS) (RFA)
Would have been nice it if it had been designed for either 2 merlin's, or 1 heavy helo i.e. Chinook or maybe even a USMC CH-53K King Stallion on an exchange program.
Even if it normally had only 1 Merlin on board.
Even if it normally had only 1 Merlin on board.
Re: Tide Class Tankers (MARS) (RFA)
So Tiderace is going to commission very soon. Tidesurge will be in the UK at the end of the month and commissioned sometime by August/September. Do we think Tideforce will make it before the end of this year or early next year? My money is on December/January for commissioning.
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Re: Tide Class Tankers (MARS) (RFA)
Tideforce was suppose to be delivered in December, shes at sea at the moment, so will only be a little late by MOD procurement standards.
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Re: Tide Class Tankers (MARS) (RFA)
They're here, they're out at sea, they're in home waters, there's no major operation requiring them.shark bait wrote:Tideforce was suppose to be delivered in December, shes at sea at the moment, so will only be a little late by MOD procurement standards.
It's a good position to be in to ease back and just do it at the pace of best testing. Date of entry at this point is of less importance than knowing they're at the stage they are now.
Re: Tide Class Tankers (MARS) (RFA)
and has now left Antigua.Smokey wrote:Tidesurge has passed through the Panama Canal.
Re: Tide Class Tankers (MARS) (RFA)
Tidesurge has arrived off the Falmouth coast ready to be fitted out with her UK kit.
https://www.marinetraffic.com/en/ais/ho ... 87/zoom:13
Getting there...
https://www.marinetraffic.com/en/ais/ho ... 87/zoom:13
Getting there...
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Re: Tide Class Tankers (MARS) (RFA)
Today we welcome RFA TIDESURGE to the UK for the first time, as she arrives in Falmouth ahead of her customisation work, which supports 300 local jobs.
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Re: Tide Class Tankers (MARS) (RFA)
RFA TIDESPRING in the midst of it all during Exercise Joint Warrior:
Found the image on Twitter
Found the image on Twitter
Re: Tide Class Tankers (MARS) (RFA)
Note most important passage in that news piece (assuming it is accurate):
Measuring just over 200 meters in length and with a top speed of 27 knots, RFA Tidespring is a welcome addition to the fleet.
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Arma Pacis Fulcra.
Si Vis Pacem, Para Bellum
Arma Pacis Fulcra.
Si Vis Pacem, Para Bellum
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Re: Tide Class Tankers (MARS) (RFA)
Exactly what a "fleet" tanker is all about:
- can keep up
- not @18, not @ 20 ... but close to 28 (you are not doing replenishment during combat ops; but to be able to get to the general area, and "be around" could be a virtue - that has been designed in).
- can keep up
- not @18, not @ 20 ... but close to 28 (you are not doing replenishment during combat ops; but to be able to get to the general area, and "be around" could be a virtue - that has been designed in).
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)
Re: Tide Class Tankers (MARS) (RFA)
Or go get more and be back pronto.
Not sure why speed is it's most important characteristic tho'. I could think of a few higher up the list.
Not sure why speed is it's most important characteristic tho'. I could think of a few higher up the list.
Re: Tide Class Tankers (MARS) (RFA)
....so that a ship at speed and in a hurry, but needing fuel, stays at speed and doesn't need to slow down to a (sea) snails pace for RAS and delay its progress to its destination.
Re: Tide Class Tankers (MARS) (RFA)
CONREP at 27 knots. Sure.SKB wrote:....so that a ship at speed and in a hurry, but needing fuel, stays at speed and doesn't need to slow down to a (sea) snails pace for RAS and delay its progress to its destination.
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Re: Tide Class Tankers (MARS) (RFA)
Their are no front lines at sea, so where do you locate your supply ships? IMHO the best place for the RFA ships is with those they are supporting. The threat today does not come from big guns on warships but from the air and underwater so your replenishment ships are in no greater danger with your warships than if they were kept back (wherever back is at sea), and only called forward when required. In addition you would have to provide additional escorts both ASW & AAW. Where are they going to come from? Far better to concentrate your resources. Of course the problem has been that the support shipping has been relatively slow, so if the Tide class is capable of 27 knots they could keep with a Carrier Task Force a very good thing in my opinion.
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Re: Tide Class Tankers (MARS) (RFA)
Quite. The division to Fleet tankers and others (supporting singletons, which mode of deployment seems to be fading in importance) is gonewhitelancer wrote: would have to provide additional escorts both ASW & AAW. Where are they going to come from? Far better to concentrate your resources
- save for the one that does our (and other NATO) bases; and the replacement of which is shrouded in mystery... new build or another charter?
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)