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AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Postby RetroSicotte » 04 Dec 2017, 10:01

It is persistently disappointing how much capability the Wildcat could provide, if they were just supported right.

Added fuel tanks, datalinks, and Army helos upgraded with Spike-NLOS and Martlet with even just an extra bunch of them would offer so much improvement.

You could say the same thing about so many UK platforms. All the potential. None of the follow through. Basic models only in so many places.

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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Postby Lord Jim » 04 Dec 2017, 18:55

I suppose just adapting a number of Army Wildcats to shipborne operations would give the FAA something effective to operate off patrol vessels, act as plane guards and such like, freeing up the full fat Wildcats to operate off Frigates. To support SF the army only needs around 16 to equip one Regiment.

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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Postby Aethulwulf » 12 Jan 2018, 12:57

Jane's is reporting that 2 RN Wildcat HMA2s have been deployed to Oman airbase at Musannah, replacing the 2 Merlin HM2s that have been deployed in Oman since 2006.

The Wildcats are from 825 Sqn and are there to monitor shipping movements in the Straits of Hormuz.

The Merlins are being concentrated back at Culdrose to support QE air group and crowsnest.

Should be a good demonstration of the Wildcat's excellent radar and other surveillance capabilities to potential customers in the region.

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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Postby Dahedd » 12 Jan 2018, 13:38

Wild speculation in todays Times. According to the header in the story all army Wildcats and RAF Pumas to go.

Oh and the Marines and Paras to be merged together.

:roll:

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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Postby Little J » 13 Jan 2018, 00:23

I other news... Labour are to join forces with the Conservatives. :crazy:



On a serious note, saw a programme on Forces TV the other day about UK response to Hurricane Maria featuring Wildcat, by all accounts it did a sterling job.

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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Postby Caribbean » 13 Jan 2018, 10:50

I heard that they were operating two Wildcat and the Cayman Police EC-135 off one of the Bays for a while - the source was the "Marl Road" (aka local rumour), so not sure how accurate, but interesting if true - not heard of the Bays supporting that many at the same time before
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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Postby ArmChairCivvy » 13 Jan 2018, 10:57

Caribbean wrote: not heard of the Bays supporting that many at the same time before


If my memory does not fail me, I think two Chinooks have been tested> I would not think both "hot" at the same time as the downdraft created by one, at a time, is quite enough.
- most sources, as far as Chinooks go, stick to one (this one talks about accommodating, not operating http://enacademic.com/dic.nsf/enwiki/342326 ; I guess hence the trials?)

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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Postby Caribbean » 13 Jan 2018, 11:22

ArmChairCivvy wrote:accommodating, not operating

Yes - should have been clearer - that was the point that intrigued me - they were operating three (albeit light) helicopters at the same time, if only for a relatively short period before land-based facilities became available.
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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Postby Smokey » 01 Feb 2018, 12:52


RetroSicotte
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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Postby RetroSicotte » 01 Feb 2018, 14:21

Very nice, very nice indeed.

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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Postby shark bait » 02 Feb 2018, 09:28

Is that a funded retrofit? or another handful of wishful thinking?
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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Postby Gabriele » 02 Feb 2018, 09:42

Wonder if it is meant to provide some lift and reduce fuel consumption. Wildcat's legs are notoriously not very long...
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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Postby ArmChairCivvy » 02 Feb 2018, 11:02

No mention of army (AAC) Wildcats at all
- put some Spike NLOS onto those stubs, and get some fast moving precision artillery on the cheap (as there seems to be only very fluctuating plans as to their use; those leaked Three Options for cuts seemed to have the fleet in their sights :? )

According to DID (of today) it may be the other fleet, instead, that will go early:
"The British Army is considering what options it has ahead of replacing its ageing fleet of Aérospatiale Gazelle AH1 helicopters. Used by the Army Air Corps in the reconnaissance and battlefield liaison role, 22 examples are still in the Army's inventory, and the service initially intended to keep the helicopters flying until 2025. However, due to the shortage of spares parts and the requirement of a highly trained crew to operate a single pilot aircraft in often adverse weather conditions, the retirement date of the Gazelles may be brought forward, Air Cdre Al Smith told the Defence IQ International Military Helicopter conference in London."

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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Postby Dahedd » 02 Feb 2018, 19:55

If the Wildcats range ain't great I wonder if the wing's & chopper can be rigged to take fuel tanks in the same way as the Apache.

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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Postby RunningStrong » 02 Feb 2018, 21:09

Gabriele wrote:Wonder if it is meant to provide some lift and reduce fuel consumption. Wildcat's legs are notoriously not very long...

I've always wondered how on earth you can create lift off a stub wing when you've got a rotor blade directly above!

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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Postby ArmChairCivvy » 02 Feb 2018, 22:06

RunningStrong wrote:I've always wondered how on earth you can create lift off a stub wing when you've got a rotor blade directly above!


Wiki tells us what came before the Lynx, before the Wildcat (1970s were are talking about):
"Considerable attention was given to making the Mi-24 fast. The airframe was streamlined, and fitted with retractable tricycle undercarriage landing gear to reduce drag. At high speed, the wings provide considerable lift (up to a quarter of total lift). The main rotor was tilted 2.5° to the right from the fuselage to compensate for translating tendency at a hover. The landing gear was also tilted to the left so that the rotor would still be level when the aircraft was on the ground, making the rest of the airframe tilt to the left. The tail was also asymmetrical to give a side force at speed, thus unloading the tail rotor.[9]

A modified Mi-24B, named A-10, was used in several speed and time-to-climb world record attempts. The helicopter had been modified to reduce weight as much as possible—one measure was the removal of the stub wings.[4] The official speed record set on 13 August 1975 over a closed 1000 km course of 332.65 km/h (206.7 mph) still stands, as do many of the female-specific records set by the all-female crew of Galina Rastorguyeva and Lyudmila Polyanskaya.[10] On 21 September 1978, the A-10 set the absolute speed record for helicopters with 368.4 km/h (228.9 mph) over a 15/25 km course. The record stood until 1986, when it was broken by the ["current"] official record holder, a modified Westland Lynx.[11]

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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Postby Jensy » 03 Feb 2018, 02:47

Are these wings potentially foldable?

If not, will this prevent two Wildcats fitting in a single hangar on the T26 and T45?

Probably not something of the highest concern right now, but it always seemed like a nice option if needed.

As an aside I was lucky enough to visit Yeovil a few years back with work and see the Lynx/Wildcat production line. Amazing chaps down there, although they all had a strange speech impediment which meant they skipped over the 'Agusta' part of AgustaWestland.

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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Postby Lord Jim » 03 Feb 2018, 03:24

You won't be seeing two wildcats operating from any RN escort. It is a single Wildcat or single Merlin. Whether some sort of VTOL UAV, if small enough is also operated is another matter, but those are on the "Nice to have", wish list at the moment.

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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Postby Little J » 03 Feb 2018, 05:42

Jensy wrote:As an aside I was lucky enough to visit Yeovil a few years back with work and see the Lynx/Wildcat production line. Amazing chaps down there, although they all had a strange speech impediment which meant they skipped over the 'Agusta' part of AgustaWestland.

Jensy

I can imagine that that impediment has only got worse since the change to Leo Helicopters :lol:

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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Postby Jensy » 03 Feb 2018, 19:04

Lord Jim wrote:You won't be seeing two wildcats operating from any RN escort. It is a single Wildcat or single Merlin. Whether some sort of VTOL UAV, if small enough is also operated is another matter, but those are on the "Nice to have", wish list at the moment.


No doubt on the UAV.

I suppose this then raises the question of why we need a smaller helicopter at all, if all the hangars are sized for a hefty Merlin?

Still at least we're not Canada.

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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Postby Timmymagic » 03 Feb 2018, 19:51

ArmChairCivvy wrote:Wiki tells us what came before the Lynx, before the Wildcat (1970s were are talking about):


For the West the biggest winged helicopter loss (apart from the AH-56 which was more correctly a compound) was the winged Chinook (BV-347). Quite why it's never been adopted in the 3 upgrades since is beyond me, the benefits from it were huge.

http://www.chinook-helicopter.com/histo ... 07992.html

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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Postby Dahedd » 03 Feb 2018, 21:52

Love the Chinook, not seen that before. I seem to recall a concept sketch of an AEW Merlin with the same wing idea.

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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Postby ArmChairCivvy » 04 Feb 2018, 02:48

Timmymagic wrote:
For the West the biggest winged helicopter loss (apart from the AH-56 which was more correctly a compound) was the winged Chinook (BV-347). Quite why it's never been adopted in the 3 upgrades since is beyond me, the benefits from it were huge.

http://www.chinook-helicopter.com/histo ... 07992.html


A great find! And right next to the Flying Banana in the museum.

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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Postby Timmymagic » 04 Feb 2018, 09:42

ArmChairCivvy wrote: great find! And right next to the Flying Banana in the museum.


It's really one of the most odd decisions not to roll it out ever. Just imagine a modern one. Nr. 10 ft fuselage stretch, all of usable space, stick the new large tanks on it, new blades (and remember both front and rear are longer by about 4 ft. each so more lift) and 5,000+hp engines. It would have saved the US in particular a fortune. No need for CH-53K with that around.

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Re: AW159 Wildcat Helicopter (RN & AAC)

Postby SKB » 01 Sep 2018, 19:50



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