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L85A1/A2/A3 - SA80 Assault Rifle

Contains threads on Joint Service equipment of the past, present and future.
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SKB
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Re: SA80 Assault Rifle (Army)

Postby SKB » 29 May 2015, 22:49

SA80 video with Andy McNab. If you have a problem with the data, please take it up with Mr. McNab ;)



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Re: SA80 Assault Rifle (Army)

Postby Tony Williams » 30 May 2015, 03:42

Thanks for posting this. A couple of comments:

The only version of the L22 carbine to see service is the L22A2. The L22A1 was not adopted.

The L86A2 has recently staged something of a recovery, while the L110A1 (Para Minimi) has somewhat fallen out of favour, for the same reason - effective range. The short-barrelled L110 is a bullet spray which I have heard BA officers say is only useful at up to 200m, while the L86A2 is now claimed to be capable at up to 600m, due to its greater accuracy and much longer barrel.

I am somewhat sceptical about the last claim - it is noticeable that in peacetime, with lots of time to analyse ballistic charts etc, the claimed effective range of 5.56mm weapons tends to creep upwards. As soon as we find ourselves in a serious shooting war at such long ranges, an urgent call goes out for 7.62mm rifles and MGs to be issued to the sections...

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Re: SA80 Assault Rifle (Army)

Postby marktigger » 30 May 2015, 05:55

nice repeat thread on the Rifle 5.56mm L85A1/A2

viewtopic.php?f=42&t=31

get the name right a SAA instructor will chew you a new one for calling it SA80

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Re: rifle 5.56mm L85/A1/A2/ (The Rifle/ Sa80)

Postby Little J » 30 May 2015, 13:25

I've read rumours of an L86 A3, with DD rails etc.

Does it exist or is it another load of 'net botox?

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Re: rifle 5.56mm L85/A1/A2/ (The Rifle/ Sa80)

Postby downsizer » 30 May 2015, 13:29

Net bollox. A2s that have been through ABRO of late come back with a stamp A3 and a longer sight rail. The weapon system is still an A2 in UK service designation though and uses the NSN of the A2, so despite what some ill informed dorks may say, there is no A3 in service.

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Re: rifle 5.56mm L85/A1/A2/ (The Rifle/ Sa80)

Postby Tinman » 31 May 2015, 11:24

downsizer wrote:Net bollox. A2s that have been through ABRO of late come back with a stamp A3 and a longer sight rail. The weapon system is still an A2 in UK service designation though and uses the NSN of the A2, so despite what some ill informed dorks may say, there is no A3 in service.



Ive seen a "pimped up" one in the armoury basically all the flashy flashy off the L129. Armourers are strange folk!

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Re: rifle 5.56mm L85/A1/A2/ (The Rifle/ Sa80)

Postby marktigger » 31 May 2015, 13:39

downsizer wrote:Indeed, thats why we had to buy the 7.62 sharpshooter rifles.



funny we all used to carry 7.62mm rifles and had a GPMG integral in each section.

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Re: rifle 5.56mm L85/A1/A2/ (The Rifle/ Sa80)

Postby The Armchair Soldier » 23 Jun 2015, 10:51

just-me-again wrote:Is there still a replacement scheduled for 2020 or has that been shelved?

Some info from a recent Written Answer:
Andrew Gwynne wrote:To ask the Secretary of State for Defence, in what year he plans to introduce a replacement for the SA80 assault rifle.
Philip Dunne wrote:The SA80 rifle is due to go out of service in 2025 and a review of the options to replace the rifle is in its early stages. This review will include potentially extending its use beyond 2025.

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Re: rifle 5.56mm L85/A1/A2/ (The Rifle/ Sa80)

Postby arfah » 23 Jun 2015, 23:38

.................
-<>-<>-<>-

Why this forum is pish!

1: Ineffective moderators
2: Too many fantasists ruining dedicated equipment threads with notions of what gun/mortar/artillery/missiles the equipment should have because it makes their panties moist.

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Re: rifle 5.56mm L85/A1/A2/ (The Rifle/ Sa80)

Postby marktigger » 24 Jun 2015, 21:45

what 1895-1977

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Re: rifle 5.56mm L85/A1/A2/ (The Rifle/ Sa80)

Postby raven111 » 24 Jun 2015, 22:22

marktigger wrote:what 1895-1977


SMLE didn't come along until 1907 and left general issue in 1941.

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Re: rifle 5.56mm L85/A1/A2/ (The Rifle/ Sa80)

Postby arfah » 24 Jun 2015, 22:25

.................
-<>-<>-<>-

Why this forum is pish!

1: Ineffective moderators
2: Too many fantasists ruining dedicated equipment threads with notions of what gun/mortar/artillery/missiles the equipment should have because it makes their panties moist.

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Re: rifle 5.56mm L85/A1/A2/ (The Rifle/ Sa80)

Postby marktigger » 25 Jun 2015, 00:39

lee metford goes back to 1880's

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Re: rifle 5.56mm L85/A1/A2/ (The Rifle/ Sa80)

Postby marktigger » 25 Jun 2015, 00:42

SMLE came out in 1903

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Re: rifle 5.56mm L85/A1/A2/ (The Rifle/ Sa80)

Postby arfah » 25 Jun 2015, 07:34

................
-<>-<>-<>-

Why this forum is pish!

1: Ineffective moderators
2: Too many fantasists ruining dedicated equipment threads with notions of what gun/mortar/artillery/missiles the equipment should have because it makes their panties moist.

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Re: rifle 5.56mm L85/A1/A2/ (The Rifle/ Sa80)

Postby marktigger » 25 Jun 2015, 09:00

internationally they are still in production and service.

Yes the SMLE was as controversial when it entered service. But for the right reasons and it did prove to be a world stopper unlike the SA80.

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Re: rifle 5.56mm L85/A1/A2/ (The Rifle/ Sa80)

Postby raven111 » 25 Jun 2015, 12:52

marktigger wrote:SMLE came out in 1903


The SMLE Mk.III that would serve through both world wars didn't hit service until '07.

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Re: rifle 5.56mm L85/A1/A2/ (The Rifle/ Sa80)

Postby marktigger » 25 Jun 2015, 12:56

And the SMLE was due to be replaced in 1914 due to the complaints of the army and target rifle community

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Re: rifle 5.56mm L85/A1/A2/ (The Rifle/ Sa80)

Postby raven111 » 25 Jun 2015, 18:31

marktigger wrote:And the SMLE was due to be replaced in 1914 due to the complaints of the army and target rifle community


More because the MLEs used in South Africa and the .303 round were completely outclassed by the Mausers used by the Boers.

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Re: rifle 5.56mm L85/A1/A2/ (The Rifle/ Sa80)

Postby Little J » 25 Jun 2015, 18:42

marktigger wrote:internationally they are still in production and service.

Yes the SMLE was as controversial when it entered service. But for the right reasons and it did prove to be a world stopper unlike the SA80.


The SA80 was a world stopper... Everyone in the world stopped and asked "really?" :lol:

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Re: rifle 5.56mm L85/A1/A2/ (The Rifle/ Sa80)

Postby marktigger » 25 Jun 2015, 21:33

raven111 wrote:
marktigger wrote:And the SMLE was due to be replaced in 1914 due to the complaints of the army and target rifle community


More because the MLEs used in South Africa and the .303 round were completely outclassed by the Mausers used by the Boers.



more to do with the fact the British army tried to fight in the same way it had done since waterloo form in lines and fire by volley. unlike the Boers who were taught to shoot as individuals and fight as skirmishers. Allot of the Boers had Martini Henry rifles and at the end MLE. The MLE was to long to be effective as a horse soldier rifle and the carbine was to short to be effective. Mauser also had 5rd clips. Which the MLE was fitted for. Our attempt at a 7mm mauser action rifle was a complete flop the P13. it did reappear as the P14 in .303 and was quickly relegated to second line use and was carried by the bulk of the US WW1 army in Europe as the P17 (many sold to us in 1940 for the home guard)
What changed for the BEF in WW1 was the army actually took lessons on board the standard of musketry was radically improved as where the tactics and the Short Magazine Lee Enfield was brought in to replace carbine and rifle with mounted and dismounted troops. Thats where the problems started.

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Re: rifle 5.56mm L85/A1/A2/ (The Rifle/ Sa80)

Postby marktigger » 29 Aug 2015, 16:40

whats the OSD for the SA80?

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Re: rifle 5.56mm L85/A1/A2/ (The Rifle/ Sa80)

Postby The Armchair Soldier » 29 Aug 2015, 18:46

marktigger wrote:whats the OSD for the SA80?
2025 according to a written answer by Philip Dunne. See my post on the previous page.

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Re: rifle 5.56mm L85/A1/A2/ (The Rifle/ Sa80)

Postby arfah » 29 Aug 2015, 19:21

.................
-<>-<>-<>-

Why this forum is pish!

1: Ineffective moderators
2: Too many fantasists ruining dedicated equipment threads with notions of what gun/mortar/artillery/missiles the equipment should have because it makes their panties moist.

marktigger
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Re: rifle 5.56mm L85/A1/A2/ (The Rifle/ Sa80)

Postby marktigger » 11 Sep 2016, 23:49

so now the A3 :roll:


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