UK Defence Forum

Posted: **20 Dec 2018, 12:51**

The ones around Gatwick must be UK drones (as they are flying in the UK airspace)
... and here folks that have gone "hunting them" are pictured ( with shotguns

) https://e3.365dm.com/18/12/1096x616/sky ... 1220121425

Posted: **20 Dec 2018, 13:30**

I say ban them all to those without a pilots licence. They don't allow people to drive cars on the ground without a drivers licence.

Posted: **20 Dec 2018, 13:54**

Found a use for the T26 mission bay to give them some firepower, load up with Narco sem-submeribles, replace the 1t cocaine with HE, add AI navigation, radio and sensor

Posted: **20 Dec 2018, 15:09**

SKB wrote:I say ban them all to those without a pilots licence. They don't allow people to drive cars on the ground with a drivers licence.

Anything over 20 kg (IIRC) needs a drone pilots licence at the moment. The aircraft needs to be registered as well

Posted: **20 Dec 2018, 16:58**

Got to question whether it might be cheaper to just have a permanent counter-drone presence at airports.

Can guarantee you that a whole year's budget to do this for every airport in the country woulda probably been cheaper than the cost incurred by what just happened in 48 hours.

Government could take a long look at this when they consider the defence budget. These two drones just demonstrated on a small scale what happens when you don't fund defence properly, and then allow the consequences to happen.

It always costs more to take the risk. Always.

Posted: **20 Dec 2018, 17:29**

RetroSicotte wrote: have a permanent counter-drone presence at airports.

Yes, why not. As it does not have to be like the ones fielded on army manoeuvres (dealing with swarms/ dealing with dozens of targets in quick succession). Something like this; could be flown by the air traffic controllers
"The Blighter Anti-UAV (unmanned aerial vehicle) Defense System (AUDS) scans the skies for drones, tracks their movements, then jams the radio control signals that keep them flying. After locking onto the target, the system focuses a high-powered radio signal at it, breaking the connection between drone and driver.

Blighter Surveillance Systems makes the Ku-band radar element that detects the UAVs within 5 miles. Chess Dynamics makes the camera that tracks their movements. Enterprise Control Systems, Ltd. makes the directional radio frequency inhibitor that takes them out of the sky."

The proposal from the pilots union was to extend the airport "drone exclusion zone" from 1 km out to 5 km.
- so one of these (in the air, so probs two needed) could secure/ detect pretty much out to that kind of "perimeter"

Posted: **20 Dec 2018, 19:22**

I might need to reach for a tinfoil hat and obviously there are numerous other possibilities (with the most likely simply being someone gets their jollies from ruining other people's Christmas jollies) but I can't help thinking that there is a country which is plenty angry at the UK, views causing disruption and economic cost as forming part of hybrid warfare, might wish to demonstrate that despite having intelligence agents deported they retain the ability to act with impunity within the UK, could easily carry out untraceable modifications to enable commercial drones to fly for longer, possibly be able to mask where the signal comes from and has been having its own problems with waves of modified drones flying towards an airbase.....

Posted: **20 Dec 2018, 20:09**

Make ownership and operation punishable by death

Posted: **20 Dec 2018, 20:32**

Phil Sayers wrote:be able to mask where the signal comes from

That's why 'zapping' it at the receiving end is the easiest solution?

Posted: **20 Dec 2018, 20:40**

ArmChairCivvy wrote:
Phil Sayers wrote:be able to mask where the signal comes from
That's why 'zapping' it at the receiving end is the easiest solution?

I don't know anything about how drones and their signals actually work so could be completely wrong but I would be surprised if the signal controlling a standard toy or commercial drone in the air couldn't be easily traced back to the operator. That whoever is behind this has been able to make multiple flights without that happening is part of what is making me suspicious about whether it is just a 'normal' drone being used.

Posted: **20 Dec 2018, 21:42**

Phil Sayers wrote:would be surprised if the signal controlling a standard toy or commercial drone in the air couldn't be easily traced back to the operator

Constant frequency hopping (in controlling the 'non-std' ones) is a good trick. In this 18 sec footage the signal was so strong, however, that as the attack helos passed, weapon release for their rockets happened, as it happened to be one of the frequencies
- and by coincidence they were coming straight at the control station (and fired on it)
- and through another coincidence, someone was completely oblivious to the fact that he was standing next to the control station (truck) and the footage was released on the internet
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/ ... -war-games

Now we know why they do so much EMC testing with everything that goes on carriers
... if there is an accidental weapon release, there might be another loaded plane/ helo in the way, and off goes the chain reaction

Posted: **20 Dec 2018, 22:16**

Why are there no pictures or videos of this drone at Gatwick, which has now been flying around for more than 24 hours and appeared "over fifty times" according to the BBC ?

Posted: **21 Dec 2018, 02:44**

SKB wrote:Why are there no pictures or videos of this drone at Gatwick, which has now been flying around for more than 24 hours and appeared "over fifty times" according to the BBC ?

Where's the footage going to come from? It's an airport's extended grounds and airspace, not exactly covered in public footage.

Posted: **21 Dec 2018, 03:36**

Footage could be obtained from the airport's perimeter security cameras, from passengers inside the terminal buildings, from the nearby hotels, from the town of Crawley to the immediate south, from the town of Horley to the immediate north, from the A23 dual carriageway to the airports east perimeter, from the mainline London-Brighton railway which has a station attached to the South Terminal. Or from planespotters camped at the airport's rural western edge near to the village of Charlwood.

Gatwick is the UK's second biggest airport, its sandwiched between two towns and the busy London-Brighton transport routes. There are cameras literally EVERYWHERE. I find it strange that not a single image or video of a drone have been shared so far.

Posted: **21 Dec 2018, 04:27**

I don't imagine many point into the sky. And members of the public were discouraged from going outside the terminals to look for them.

It's hardly a conspiracy mate.

Posted: **21 Dec 2018, 07:28**

Those shot guns (in the footage

) must be pointed well away from the runways
... or what's left on the grounds could end up sucked into the jet turbines; round bits, but hard!

And Santa had let it be known that he will soon have to start his own travels, so that set the priorities

: "service resumes

The first flight after 32 hours of drone disruption left for Lapland "

Posted: **21 Dec 2018, 10:47**

Phil Sayers wrote:
ArmChairCivvy wrote:
Phil Sayers wrote:be able to mask where the signal comes from
That's why 'zapping' it at the receiving end is the easiest solution?
I don't know anything about how drones and their signals actually work so could be completely wrong but I would be surprised if the signal controlling a standard toy or commercial drone in the air couldn't be easily traced back to the operator. That whoever is behind this has been able to make multiple flights without that happening is part of what is making me suspicious about whether it is just a 'normal' drone being used.

It doesn't necessarily need a signal. Set to fly a predetermined route using waypoints and inertial navigation, it can operate without control signals or GPS, atleast within the easily navigated confines of an airfield.

Posted: **21 Dec 2018, 10:56**

Yes, autonomy in that sort of pre-programmed way
... and AI making its way to here, too

So far, weapon release (they didn't have any) reserved for the humans

Posted: **21 Dec 2018, 11:25**

Made me chuckle

Posted: **21 Dec 2018, 13:04**

SKB wrote:Footage could be obtained from the airport's perimeter security cameras

Yes, I'm sure that Gatwick security's prime priority right now is editing and releasing footage from cameras for the entertainment of the public.

from passengers inside the terminal buildings, from the nearby hotels, from the town of Crawley to the immediate south, from the town of Horley to the immediate north, from the A23 dual carriageway to the airports east perimeter, from the mainline London-Brighton railway which has a station attached to the South Terminal. Or from planespotters camped at the airport's rural western edge near to the village of Charlwood.

Most of the approaches since people knew to actually look for them have been at night. There's a couple videos only now lurking around. But it's no surprise there's not a lot of sightings when it's in areas the public generally aren't, at night, being very small, in an area now crammed with helicopters and their own lights and sounds in sky.

Gatwick is the UK's second biggest airport

Making it very clear why it's not as common to see it. Gatwick is gigantic.

There are cameras literally EVERYWHERE. I find it strange that not a single image or video of a drone have been shared so far.

Go look at the cameras. Go look at their default arc. It's at the ground.

Posted: **21 Dec 2018, 18:23**

And closed again, more drone sightings.

Posted: **22 Dec 2018, 15:38**

https://news.sussex.police.uk/news/two- ... cialSignIn

A 47-year-old man and 54-year-old woman from Crawley are being questioned in connection with multiple drone sightings that brought Gatwick Airport to a standstill.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-46658868

Posted: **23 Dec 2018, 16:28**

Sussex Police statement:

Two people arrested in conjunction with the widespread disruption of flights at Gatwick Airport through the illegal use of drones have been released without charge on Sunday (23 December).

Sussex Police Detective Chief Superintendent Jason Tingley said: “Both people have fully co-operated with our enquiries and I am satisfied that they are no longer suspects in the drone incidents at Gatwick.

“It is important to remember that when people are arrested in an effort to make further enquiries it does not mean that they are guilty of an offence and Sussex Police would not seek to make their identity public.

“Our inquiry continues at a pace to locate those responsible for the drone incursions, and we continue to actively follow lines of investigation.

“We ask for the public’s continued support by reporting anything suspicious, contacting us with any information in relation to the drone incidents at Gatwick."

Gatwick Airport Limited has offered a £50,000 reward through Crimestoppers, for information leading to the arrest and conviction of those responsible for the criminal act that disrupted flights.

If you have any information please contact Crimestoppers 100% anonymously on 0800 555 111 or through their anonymous online form at Crimestoppers website. Payout on the reward will be made only if the information is given to Crimestoppers first.

Posted: **25 Dec 2018, 18:44**

So, who's brave enough to admit "I got a drone for Christmas!" first ?

Posted: **26 Dec 2018, 18:59**

SKB wrote:So, who's brave enough to admit "I got a drone for Christmas!" first ?

Or more importantly, who's brave enough to admit that they lost their drone a few days before Christmas somewhere in the vicinity of Gatwick?

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