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F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Contains threads on Joint Service equipment of the past, present and future.

How do you feel about the F-35B for the RN and RAF? (2 votes per member)

GOOD choice for the Royal Navy
115
45%
BAD choice for the Royal Navy
9
4%
Uncertain (RN)
12
5%
GOOD choice for the Royal Air Force
46
18%
BAD choice for the Royal Air Force
35
14%
Uncertain (RAF)
38
15%
 
Total votes: 255

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby ArmChairCivvy » 23 Jan 2019, 05:32

Ron5 wrote:Officials see an overseas trip for the F-35 as a way of testing the deployability of the aircraft, its associated systems and its personnel.
Worthwhile in itself, even if the a/c were to do nothing operationally
- ALIS supposedly has been underinvested in (and IPR between LM & the US Gvmnt was still under negotiation when I last heard about it... may be someone here knows the state of play?)
Ron5 wrote:Lightning Force Cmdr. Air Cmdre. David Bradshaw told the RAF’s official review, published at year-end, that there had been challenges in moving the aircraft from the U.S. to the UK.

- data, data, data
- Norway & Italy are jointly funding the splitting of mission data off the ALIS file that goes back to the US (... and is readily 'hackable'! May be we should join the effort?)
Ron5 wrote:two more front-line squadrons on top of the current five will be formed. The first of these will become active with 9 Sqdn. this May, dedicated to the QRA and red-air aggressor training mission.
[...]

The second unit, the 12 Sqdn., will be a joint unit with the Qatar Emiri Air Force, supporting the training of Qatari personnel
That's the way I like it: fly all the hrs remaining off those airframes
- the article does not 'solve' the controversy about these sqdrns being pure-bred Tr1 or mixed? Statements in both :wtf: directions have been released

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SKB
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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby SKB » 25 Jan 2019, 18:18


NickC
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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby NickC » 01 Feb 2019, 11:36

Bloomberg reporting that the Pentagon DOT&E 2019 report saying the early F-35Bs only good enough for life of 2,100 hours, plan was for 8,000 hours lifespan, due to structural problems, unknown if later production aircraft have improved structural life. The original F-35B fatigue testing of the structural airframe was cancelled because it was "no longer representative" of production aircraft. Original F-35B was overweight and 2,700 lbs taken out on re-design. The F-35 JSF has now received funding for a new structural test F-35B airframe for fatigue testing of the current build configuration, but as yet it has not actually acquired airframe and start testing. F-35A airframe did complete its fatigue testing successfully.

The DOT&E have also reported over many years problems with ALIS, now the Pentagon planning to award Lockheed, MIT, Mitre and Spawar new contract to re-write the $ billion software for F-35 ALIS system, which was supposed to provide planning for operations, maintenance and logistics and compared to previous generation aircraft give the F-35 fleet reduced operations and maintenance costs and increase aircraft availability.

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby ArmChairCivvy » 01 Feb 2019, 11:44

NickC wrote:the Pentagon planning to award Lockheed, MIT, Mitre and Spawar new contract to re-write the $ billion software for F-35 ALIS system, which was supposed to provide planning for operations, maintenance and logistics and compared to previous generation aircraft give the F-35 fleet reduced operations and maintenance costs and increase aircraft availability.

Anything more on that?

NickC
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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby NickC » 01 Feb 2019, 11:51

ArmChairCivvy wrote:
NickC wrote:the Pentagon planning to award Lockheed, MIT, Mitre and Spawar new contract to re-write the $ billion software for F-35 ALIS system, which was supposed to provide planning for operations, maintenance and logistics and compared to previous generation aircraft give the F-35 fleet reduced operations and maintenance costs and increase aircraft availability.

Anything more on that?


Not have seen, apologies for not quoting source - Inside Defense

"Lockheed to team with MIT, MITRE and SPAWAR to re-architect F-35's ALIS
By Courtney Albon
January 31, 2019 at 2:42 PM
The Defense Department is making plans to award Lockheed Martin a new contract to re-architect the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter's troubled Autononomic Logistics Information System. The department announced its plan to sole-source the work to Lockheed in a Jan. 18 Federal Business Opportunity notice. F-35 joint program office spokesman Joe DellaVedova told Inside Defense the effort, dubbed ALIS Next, is intended to "provide significant improvements in affordability, supportability, resiliency, and cybersecurity. Lockheed will team with MIT Lincoln Labs, MITRE Corp.,..."

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby ArmChairCivvy » 01 Feb 2019, 12:26

NickC wrote: ALIS Next, is intended to "provide significant improvements in affordability, supportability, resiliency, and cybersecurity.


Thanks - over the last couple of years their NAO (GAO) has been scathing about what has been delivered (and also about how much budgeting for it has been behind from "full operation"). Whether the question was separate from that (perhaps not?), the Pentagon and LM have been at loggerheads over the related IP
- highlighting these things has brought the wrath of folks I call "techno-infantiles" in various defence forums across Europe... which is just proof of them being fact-free zealots. Suits me fine: gives me a soap box to speak from :lol:

Anyway. ALIS Next is a recognition that the issues have been real :idea:

bobp
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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby bobp » 01 Feb 2019, 16:14

I think this article explains some of the issues with the ALIS and its reliability, the airframe hours, and the gun.

https://www.defensenews.com/air/2019/02 ... -missions/

topman
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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby topman » 01 Feb 2019, 17:28

No great surprise the challenge is absolutely massive, especially on the development of ALIS, it's as bid a job as the aircraft itself.

bobp
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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby bobp » 01 Feb 2019, 17:45

Some more information on the redesign of the ALIS system here

http://www.defense-aerospace.com/articl ... esign-f_35’s-flawed-alis-computer-backbone.html

Lord Jim
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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby Lord Jim » 01 Feb 2019, 22:45

Lets hope they do a better job that we did with the RAF's Logistics Information Technology Strategy (LITS) that was a multi million pound disaster and was never fully rolled out, but that is a long post for another day and another thread. I'll just say ee ended up calling it "Lost In Time and Space".

topman
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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby topman » 01 Feb 2019, 23:06

ALIS is an order of magnitude bigger and more complex than LITS. An app on a phone is probably better and easier to use than Leave It To Someone(else)!

Although having said that it's still going and will be for years yet.

Lord Jim
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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby Lord Jim » 03 Feb 2019, 00:49

It will be interesting to see how ALIS progresses. I remember a presentation in the late 1990s at the DLP where we were told of the new USAF logistics management system, prior to which the service didn't no where at least 40% of its inventory was at any given time. Their solution was very good compared to what we were using at the time using this thing called the internet. We put everything behind walls unconnected to the internet, afraid someone might wee where we stored our loo paper and how much we had. They had everything on line except those things that definitely, positively were not to be accessible. There system seemed to work well and was cost effective. Ours was old and tired and the replacement LITS ended up only being rolled out for the engineering aspects and the logistics side quietly died. I do not know what they use now but most of the work is now in the hands of industry anyway.

topman
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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby topman » 03 Feb 2019, 06:54

Supply use MJDI, it's a tri service system.

sea_eagle
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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby sea_eagle » 05 Feb 2019, 14:07

UK opens High-G training site for fighter jets
https://navaltoday.com/2019/02/05/uk-opens-high-g-training-site-for-fighter-jets/

A new High-G training and test facility used by fast jet pilots in the Royal Navy and Royal Air Force to replicate flight in aircraft was opened at RAF Cranwell on February 4.

Developed under a £44m project, the facility will allow pilots to experience up to 9G – nine times the normal gravitational pull of the Earth – and learn how to use their specialist in-cockpit flying equipment to help them cope with these stresses. The centrifuge can accelerate up to 9G in one second and rotate up to 34 times a minute.


I don't think I want to have a go if they ever have an open day :crazy:

RetroSicotte
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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby RetroSicotte » 05 Feb 2019, 14:10

The centrifuge can accelerate up to 9G in one second

Bloody hell!

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SKB
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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby SKB » 05 Feb 2019, 14:42

Image
:mrgreen:
(Moonraker, if you're wondering.)

SDL
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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby SDL » 05 Feb 2019, 14:44

0-9G in a second? bloody hell

dmereifield
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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby dmereifield » 12 Feb 2019, 22:17

https://des.mod.uk/uk-wins-global-500m- ... ssignment/

UK wins global F-35 support assignment worth £500M

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby ArmChairCivvy » 13 Feb 2019, 08:17

dmereifield wrote:https://des.mod.uk/uk-wins-global-500m-f35-support-assignment/

UK wins global F-35 support assignment worth £500M


Engine repairs still planned to be done in Turkey? "It [the above int'l support contract] will see crucial maintenance, repair, overhaul and upgrade services for an even wider range of F-35 avionic, electronic and electrical systems for hundreds of F-35 aircraft based globally."

Timmymagic
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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby Timmymagic » 14 Feb 2019, 11:06

ArmChairCivvy wrote:Engine repairs still planned to be done in Turkey?


I think the UK is actually going to do theirs in Norway.
I suspect the Turkey facility will be rather underused and the Italian, Dutch and Norwegian facilities will get more work.

bobp
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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby bobp » 14 Feb 2019, 21:07


donald_of_tokyo
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Re: F-35B Lightning (RAF & RN)

Postby donald_of_tokyo » 17 Feb 2019, 14:22

Navylookout pointed us to an interesting report on F35A, air-2-air capability.

https://theaviationist.com/2019/02/16/t ... to-emerge/


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