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Future UK Combat Aircraft (Project Tempest)

Contains threads on Royal Air Force equipment of the past, present and future.
Defiance
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Re: Future UK Combat Aircraft (Project Tempest)

Postby Defiance » 18 Jul 2018, 16:39

Ron5 wrote:Firstly, someone should give that man a better smart phone and secondly, how come nobody mentioned seeing Tempest at RIAT??


Probably kept in a tent which the regular public couldn't access.

Defiance
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Re: Future UK Combat Aircraft (Project Tempest)

Postby Defiance » 18 Jul 2018, 16:45

Little J wrote:One possibility that hasn't been mentioned yet... We team up with the yanks. Or are they not interested in the same weight/size class as us?


If they're looking at China they'll want something much fatter and more LO which means $$$$.

My personal opinion is teaming with the US would result in key skills wilting away and likely lost for good, we would be doomed to be a sub-contractor from then-on. Unless of course we want to go the Astute route and spend lots of money relearning how to do the job.

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Re: Future UK Combat Aircraft (Project Tempest)

Postby SKB » 18 Jul 2018, 17:38

Sky News' Ian King:
As impressive as the mock-up itself is the fact that 'Team Tempest' put the whole design together in just four months.

https://news.sky.com/story/tempest-jet- ... m-11440702

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Halidon
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Re: Future UK Combat Aircraft (Project Tempest)

Postby Halidon » 18 Jul 2018, 17:57

I don't think the UK gov or aerospace industry are looking for a US partnership, which would have a good chance of pushing them into a second/support role. They seem very interested in being a lead or co-lead, which would be more suited to a partner like Italy or Japan that may want to partner but isn't going to muscle them aside. As an American I'd be thrilled to see the UK get onboard with an American 6th-gen effort as they did with F-35, and not just because the MDA-BAE team had a good-looking bird. But that effort isn't likely to line up with the Tempest goals as currently expressed.

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SKB
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Re: Future UK Combat Aircraft (Project Tempest)

Postby SKB » 18 Jul 2018, 18:07

Tempest


Replica


(Dave Reeves) March 2014

inch
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Re: Future UK Combat Aircraft (Project Tempest)

Postby inch » 18 Jul 2018, 18:16

looking at the engine at the back it doesn't look as stealthy as say the f22 thrust vectoring etc ,more typhoon or am a wrong in this thinking ,and yes I know its only an early model concept but still.and going with the usa its all down to do we want british skills/design to be maintained with a ok future fighter or go with the usa for a lot lesser role but with a lot higher technical spec fighter than we are going to design .bit like f22 compaired to typhoon .plus the usa not going to give us the full fat version they would get only a very basic model but prob still better than uk designed aircraft .its all down to what are the main priorities in the end up I guess and the political imperitive at the time

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SKB
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Re: Future UK Combat Aircraft (Project Tempest)

Postby SKB » 18 Jul 2018, 18:19

Dave Reeves (the man who recorded those two Replica/FOAS model videos above ^) has claimed on his Youtube comments that the Tempest model is in fact the same model as the Replica/FOAS one!

(Dave Reeves) 18th July 2018:
That's what they're calling it now, Used to be called FOAS, It's nothing more than a plastic model, They've been wheeling the thing around Warton Aerodrome for years now!


(Dave Reeves) 17th July 2018:
This is the 'Tempest' its the exact same model they've been displaying at RIAT recently, Used to be called FOAS


And:

(Sky News Ian King) 18th July 2018
As impressive as the mock-up itself is the fact that 'Team Tempest' put the whole design together in just four months.

https://news.sky.com/story/tempest-jet- ... m-11440702

:problem:

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-Eddie-
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Re: Future UK Combat Aircraft (Project Tempest)

Postby -Eddie- » 18 Jul 2018, 18:56

On Twitter I told Tim Robinson from the Royal Aeronautical Society I'm curious whether they'll integrate planned Tempest technology on a future iteration of Typhoon to prove it first. Answer was he'd just spoken to a Eurofighter ref and I was 'spot on'.

Even if it's only one prototype (IPA 9?) with various display, engine, sensor and HMD upgrades it'd be interesting and quite different to the current Typhoon!

sunstersun
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Re: Future UK Combat Aircraft (Project Tempest)

Postby sunstersun » 18 Jul 2018, 23:02

America isn't interested in the tempest, they have the F-22 and sixth generation new plane coming out. Even beyond that it's a pretty bad idea to become too reliant on one country, even if it is USA and UK.

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Re: Future UK Combat Aircraft (Project Tempest)

Postby Ron5 » 19 Jul 2018, 00:41

SKB wrote:(Sky News Ian King) 18th July 2018

As impressive as the mock-up itself is the fact that 'Team Tempest' put the whole design together in just four months.


I posted the Tempest graphic in February. That would be 5 months ago. King is talking out his ass.

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Re: Future UK Combat Aircraft (Project Tempest)

Postby Ron5 » 19 Jul 2018, 00:44

-Eddie- wrote:On Twitter I told Tim Robinson from the Royal Aeronautical Society I'm curious whether they'll integrate planned Tempest technology on a future iteration of Typhoon to prove it first. Answer was he'd just spoken to a Eurofighter ref and I was 'spot on'.

Even if it's only one prototype (IPA 9?) with various display, engine, sensor and HMD upgrades it'd be interesting and quite different to the current Typhoon!


In other words, some of the Tempest budget will be spent on Typhoon upgrades. Some of which might or might not be applicable to Tempest. Typhoon engine upgrades, for example, will not.

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Re: Future UK Combat Aircraft (Project Tempest)

Postby Lord Jim » 19 Jul 2018, 02:28

Anything going to wards improving the Typhoons is a positive in my book, even if "Tempest" never goes beyond the demonstration phase.

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SKB
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Re: Future UK Combat Aircraft (Project Tempest)

Postby SKB » 19 Jul 2018, 12:42

Tempest has been sighted in south-east Hampshire.
Image
Serco's SD Tempest, Portsmouth Harbour
:mrgreen:

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Re: Future UK Combat Aircraft (Project Tempest)

Postby ArmChairCivvy » 19 Jul 2018, 14:32

Ron5 wrote:Typhoon engine upgrades, for example, will not.


Funnily enough the Turks wanted that for their next-gen, as one of things underpinning the design... I understand the modest contract with BAE was more related to the "form factor"?
- by now, of course, there are concerns about tech transfer with the Turks; are they only buying those SAMs so that the rest of the NATO can perfect their game against the S-400s :D

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SKB
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Re: Future UK Combat Aircraft (Project Tempest)

Postby SKB » 19 Jul 2018, 21:38


(Rolls-Royce) 19th July 2018
Joining forces with the UK government and key industry players, our advanced power and propulsion systems will play a major part in the next-generation fighter jet strategy.

Rolls-Royce is a pre-eminent engineering company focused on world-class power and propulsion systems.

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Re: Future UK Combat Aircraft (Project Tempest)

Postby inch » 19 Jul 2018, 21:51

Looking at usa 6th gen and tempest seems worlds apart to me tempest i think will be a 5th gen fighter aircraft more akin to the f22 i think , years behind use tech but thats ok we really dont have the funds they have and as i said will prob be ok for our needs i quess thats if it ever gets funded

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Re: Future UK Combat Aircraft (Project Tempest)

Postby Ron5 » 20 Jul 2018, 01:12

inch wrote:Looking at usa 6th gen and tempest seems worlds apart to me tempest i think will be a 5th gen fighter aircraft more akin to the f22 i think , years behind use tech but thats ok we really dont have the funds they have and as i said will prob be ok for our needs i quess thats if it ever gets funded


I would hope the RAF are more worried about what Russia and China will have.

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Re: Future UK Combat Aircraft (Project Tempest)

Postby shark bait » 20 Jul 2018, 07:55

inch wrote:Looking at usa 6th gen and tempest seems worlds apart to me tempest


What difference is there? We know bugger all about either of them, apart from on has a tail and one doesn't in the concept images we've seen.
@LandSharkUK

Little J
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Re: Future UK Combat Aircraft (Project Tempest)

Postby Little J » 20 Jul 2018, 11:10

Going to Farnborough tomorrow, will Tempest be on show to the public and if so, where should I be looking?

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SKB
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Re: Future UK Combat Aircraft (Project Tempest)

Postby SKB » 20 Jul 2018, 11:21

According to the 2018 Farnborough map, BAE Systems are near Gate E. If the Tempest model will be there, I do not know. I would assume not and hope to be surprised....

Map PDF download available here: https://www.farnboroughairshow.com/publ ... w-and-map/


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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: Future UK Combat Aircraft (Project Tempest)

Postby ArmChairCivvy » 20 Jul 2018, 11:46

Excellent find, thanks; will need to check what else they have posted in the last year or so

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Re: Future UK Combat Aircraft (Project Tempest)

Postby Tempest414 » 20 Jul 2018, 12:49

Maybe Canada would be a good partner in this project to my mind they would prefer a twin engine jet however there Hornets will run out way before 2040 so they would need to fill the gap with something

inch
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Re: Future UK Combat Aircraft (Project Tempest)

Postby inch » 20 Jul 2018, 12:53

im thinking shark bait ,yes no tail difference but the f22 first took to the air in 1997 the tempest 2030 ish ? that's 30 odd years behind and looking at the tempest is more akin to the f22 in looks than the 6th gen pics we have seen about the usa concepts. all the rest of world new jet concepts seem like f22/f35 type of design ie japan /south korea/turkey / india /china and now uk all trying to play catch up , but yes I agree we don't know too much yet fella and yes also agree its Russia,china we should be focusing on ron5 even then I think uk going to have its work cut out just trying to keep up with them never mind usa which is in a different league and china catching them fast I think,china has the cash and we just dont

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Re: Future UK Combat Aircraft (Project Tempest)

Postby Lord Jim » 20 Jul 2018, 17:07

I still think the next platform the RAF and MoD invest in should be an unmanned, stealthy, ISTAR/Combat platform to compliment the F-35s. It is all well and good to look to the future but I think in reality we are going to be tied to the Typhoon and F-35 variants well into the 2040s as far as manned platforms are concerned.


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