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Section infantry weapons

Contains threads on British Army equipment of the past, present and future.
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clivestonehouse1
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Re: Section infantry weapons

Postby clivestonehouse1 » 11 Sep 2019, 08:11

jimthelad wrote:Better to go down the Finnish route and rework the GPMG. Don't mess with perfection !
The GPMG has been the workhorse for many years and has always delivered the goods.
If it ain't broke.......

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

jimthelad
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Re: Section infantry weapons

Postby jimthelad » 11 Sep 2019, 08:26

totally agree, but if we could lose the 1.5kg the Finns seem to have done then perfection becomes deified!!!!

Voldemort
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Re: Section infantry weapons

Postby Voldemort » 11 Sep 2019, 09:07

jimthelad wrote:totally agree, but if we could lose the 1.5kg the Finns seem to have done then perfection becomes deified!!!!


We have done what now? Finland uses PKM.

Andy-M
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Re: Section infantry weapons

Postby Andy-M » 11 Sep 2019, 09:13

jimthelad wrote:totally agree, but if we could lose the 1.5kg the Finns seem to have done then perfection becomes deified!!!!


Are you sure you don't mean Sweden?

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: Section infantry weapons

Postby ArmChairCivvy » 11 Sep 2019, 15:41

Andy-M wrote:Are you sure you don't mean Sweden?

Their 6.5? Universal caliber - the holy grail - that was done away with, a while back?

Andy-M
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Re: Section infantry weapons

Postby Andy-M » 11 Sep 2019, 17:00

ArmChairCivvy wrote:
Andy-M wrote:Are you sure you don't mean Sweden?

Their 6.5? Universal caliber - the holy grail - that was done away with, a while back?


thought you meant the Ksp 58 DF, about half way down this link, they shortened the FN MAG.

http://www.gotavapen.se/gota/artiklar/u ... /ksp58.htm

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: Section infantry weapons

Postby ArmChairCivvy » 11 Sep 2019, 17:14

Andy-M wrote:
ArmChairCivvy wrote:
Andy-M wrote:Are you sure you don't mean Sweden?

Their 6.5? Universal caliber - the holy grail - that was done away with, a while back?


thought you meant the Ksp 58 DF, about half way down this link, they shortened the FN MAG.

http://www.gotavapen.se/gota/artiklar/u ... /ksp58.htm


Sorry, I did not know that they had converted some (or all, 3000 that would make) into the 7.62 x 51 from KSP 58 with 6,5x55 mm (originally). At the time also their ARs were using the same ammo
- The Finnish light MG from only a couple of years later was spewing out the short 7.62 at the rate of 1000 rpm - so effectively an escape weapon (carried by recce teams, to break contact)

jimthelad
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Re: Section infantry weapons

Postby jimthelad » 11 Sep 2019, 17:34

Sorry, getting my Scandinavians mixed up!!!

Qwerty
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Re: Section infantry weapons

Postby Qwerty » 13 Sep 2019, 19:43


Little J
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Re: Section infantry weapons

Postby Little J » 14 Sep 2019, 08:47

Textron's entry into the NGSW programme...
(tried attaching photo, but "Sorry, the board attachment quota has been reached")
Check out the rifle, It looks a bit... Erm, cumbersome would be the polite way to put it.
https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/201 ... rototypes/

Lord Jim
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Re: Section infantry weapons

Postby Lord Jim » 14 Sep 2019, 14:35

I wonder if anything will actually result form this programme? There is a well publicised history of the US Military trying to field the ultimate small arms with $Bns spent so far. he fact that each submission also included its own take on the desired 6.8mm ammo doesn't bode well in my books. Surely it would b better if they actually designed and agreed on a single ammo type and then went about designing weapons to use it.

bobp
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Re: Section infantry weapons

Postby bobp » 17 Sep 2019, 05:24

Seems like the SA80A3 model is going ahead

https://www.defense-aerospace.com/artic ... tract.html

Little J
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Re: Section infantry weapons

Postby Little J » 17 Sep 2019, 07:54

And I bet no one has had the common sense to get the new handguard changed from (the proprietary) HKeymod to (the superior) MLOK :clap:

Lord Jim
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Re: Section infantry weapons

Postby Lord Jim » 17 Sep 2019, 18:46

Good Question, though it does now have a rail along the entire upper part of the rifle.

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: Section infantry weapons

Postby ArmChairCivvy » 23 Oct 2019, 20:26


Lord Jim
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Re: Section infantry weapons

Postby Lord Jim » 03 Nov 2019, 18:37

https://www.janes.com/article/92294/ray ... f-munition
An interesting option for the Carl Gustav. I wonder how the cost per missile compares to the Javelin? The ability of the round to be fired within enclosed spaces would make it an excellent weapon of urban conflict. This together with the other varieties of ammunition make an even stronger argument for the Army to adopt the M4 version, especially our high readiness units which are in desperate need of additional firepower.

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Re: Section infantry weapons

Postby Lord Jim » 24 Jan 2020, 05:01

Doing some reading on the L85A2 and A3 it seems the British Army has plans to start introducing a replacement around 2025 yet even if an off the shelf weapon is chosen, shouldn't there be some work being done now to assess the various weapons available. A fly in the ointment maybe the US Army's current programmes to replace its M4, M248 and M240 with a new range of weapons with the first two firing a new intermediate round and the later to fire the .338 Lapua Magnum. Are we waiting to see how these programmes go. This would be interesting and most of NATO is going ahead and re equipping its militaries with mainly H&K or Colt Canada designs, in 5.56mm. Has anyone got any up to date information or where the UK is going regarding its next rifle or indeed collection of fire arms replacing everything but the newly adopted Glock 17s?

Andy-M
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Re: Section infantry weapons

Postby Andy-M » 24 Jan 2020, 09:39

.338 Norma Magnum, not the Lapua. I can't see them replacing anything till the Americans decide what to do, could be expensive if they have to go over to the new calibre before the new weapons have even filtered through, I suppose in five years time they might be thinking the Yanks will have sorted it out and introduced the new calibres, but does anyone think this the MOD can be that rational?

Qwerty
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Re: Section infantry weapons

Postby Qwerty » 24 Jan 2020, 10:00

The lowest bidder shall win!

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: Section infantry weapons

Postby ArmChairCivvy » 24 Jan 2020, 10:50

Qwerty wrote:The lowest bidder shall win!
There was a time when the UK Gvmnt could have bought HK with the monies it subsequently paid for HK to 'right' the half-baked design

The two first mentioned US contestants make sense, but the Norma Magnum for anything else than a vehicle mounted MG??

Little J
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Re: Section infantry weapons

Postby Little J » 24 Jan 2020, 11:38

Lord Jim wrote:Doing some reading on the L85A2 and A3 it seems the British Army has plans to start introducing a replacement around 2025...


With the A3 just being introduced, I can see the MoD's search for a new rifle starting in / after 2025 with an introduction to service around 2030... Basically giving the Yanks time to decide what our next calibre will be :silent:

Lord Jim
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Re: Section infantry weapons

Postby Lord Jim » 24 Jan 2020, 12:21

From what I have read the US Army want its M240 replacement to have a round in between the current 7,62 and the 12.7mm Browning M2. I do not think they will use this as a Section or Squad weapon but more for sustained fire support at platoon level. At Section and Squad level it will basically be the Combat Rifle and Automatic Rifle with the obligatory Under Slung Grenade Launchers. Where they will end up placing the M$ Carl Gustav is another question and will they employ a DMR version of the new rifle is another. I have also read the we and a couple of other friendly nations have a watching brief on the US Army Programme which I found interesting

Lord Jim
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Re: Section infantry weapons

Postby Lord Jim » 29 Jan 2020, 00:10

Video of a .338 GPMG.

Little J
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Re: Section infantry weapons

Postby Little J » 21 Mar 2020, 23:49

The Bullpup needs a bit more refinement, but a very clever design...


mr.fred
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Re: Section infantry weapons

Postby mr.fred » 22 Mar 2020, 11:25

Little J wrote:The Bullpup needs a bit more refinement, but a very clever design...


Based on what I’ve seen of the Grot rifles, I’m very impressed. I believe that there is a development in 7.62NATO but I don’t know if it retains the modular construction.
http://fabrykabroni.pl/en/produkty/karabiny/msbs/


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