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Re: CRV(T) Armoured Vehicle Variants (Army)

Posted: 16 May 2016, 20:16
by RunningStrong
marktigger wrote:its a shame the lessons of CVRT were forgoten scout vehicles need to have a small foot print. could we see Ajax functioning in the falklands or in Belize?

Army vehicles need to protect their occupants, that's the lesson learnt from the last 15 years. With the proliferation of RPGs and now ATGM in even the most rag-tag mob.

With that comes size. AJAX v CVR (T) weight is comparable to Snatch v Foxhound and the such.

CVR (T) lacked protection and space for modern systems. That's not to say I would scrap Scimtar 2, it certainly has it's place on the battlefield.

Re: CRV(T) Armoured Vehicle Variants (Army)

Posted: 16 May 2016, 20:18
by marktigger
yes i remember the discussions about fitting bowman to cvrt

Re: CRV(T) Armoured Vehicle Variants (Army)

Posted: 16 May 2016, 20:56
by ArmChairCivvy
RunningStrong wrote:That's not to say I would scrap Scimtar 2, it certainly has it's place on the battlefield.


Anyone know who is going to operate them? Or will the specialist versions be sprinkled all over the place? I guess the mix of the recce/ fire support vs other versions within the 50-60 total never became clear?

Re: CRV(T) Armoured Vehicle Variants (British Army)

Posted: 23 Jul 2018, 01:48
by SKB

(Matsimus) 15th June 2018

Re: CRV(T) Armoured Vehicle Variants (British Army)

Posted: 10 Feb 2019, 07:25
by ArmChairCivvy
ArmChairCivvy wrote:
RunningStrong wrote:That's not to say I would scrap Scimtar 2, it certainly has it's place on the battlefield.


Anyone know who is going to operate them? Or will the specialist versions be sprinkled all over the place? I guess the mix of the recce/ fire support vs other versions within the 50-60 total never became clear?


Has this become any clearer since (the above quote from) 2016? BAE literature says
"Capability Enhancement also involves a number of upgrades to the vehicle’s protection, taking it to an intermediate level. These include: – Ceramic ballistic armour: for KE threats"
AND
"The project has seen the next generation of CVR(T) variants – Scimitar Mk2, Spartan Mk2, Sultan Mk2, Samaritan Mk2 and Samson Mk2 – enter service in Afghanistan in 2011."

My two main points of interest:
Samaritan in all-tracked units; did it also get the KE protection enhancements?

Scimitar; where are they, as they could be got to places where no other protected fire support AFVs can be made available (fast enough, e.g. underslung)

Perhaps the 50-60 I quoted at the time related to Scimitar2 only (there were export hopes for that variant) as a total of appr. hundred across all variants has also been mentioned

Re: CRV(T) Armoured Vehicle Variants (British Army)

Posted: 10 Feb 2019, 12:12
by bobp
Some CVRT were sold in 2015 to Latvia, I don't know how many or what versions.

Re: CRV(T) Armoured Vehicle Variants (British Army)

Posted: 10 Feb 2019, 18:42
by Lord Jim
I believe they were the non-turreted versions.

Re: CRV(T) Armoured Vehicle Variants (British Army)

Posted: 10 Feb 2019, 20:12
by Caribbean
bobp wrote:Some CVRT were sold in 2015 to Latvia, I don't know how many or what versions.

We sold 123 vehicles in 2014, so probably delivered in 2015. Five variants including turreted versions (according to Wiki)

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/latvian-army-purchases-uk-armoured-combat-vehicles

Re: CRV(T) Armoured Vehicle Variants (British Army)

Posted: 11 Feb 2019, 01:18
by Lord Jim
Well if you look at the roles mentioned in the press release none are related to the Scimitar, but instead are covered by the Spartan, Sampson, Sultan and Samaritan. I cannot see why they would want to introduce the 30mm Rarden to their inventory, so as always I will take Wiki with a pinch of salt.

Re: CRV(T) Armoured Vehicle Variants (British Army)

Posted: 11 Feb 2019, 06:14
by RunningStrong
Lord Jim wrote:Well if you look at the roles mentioned in the press release none are related to the Scimitar, but instead are covered by the Spartan, Sampson, Sultan and Samaritan. I cannot see why they would want to introduce the 30mm Rarden to their inventory, so as always I will take Wiki with a pinch of salt.

Video?


Re: CRV(T) Armoured Vehicle Variants (British Army)

Posted: 11 Feb 2019, 07:23
by ArmChairCivvy
Towards the end, the non-turreted version appearing seems have a launcher arm (with nothing attached)
- I wonder for what for? Latvia is a Spike user, and they have stated that the missiles will be both for AFVs and for dismounted troops. Which AFVs has not been stated (though they had two ex-Soviet recce wagons and some Humvees (an AFV??) prior to the CVR(T) purchase... quite a steal that was : 123, refurbed, for e 48 mln

Re: CRV(T) Armoured Vehicle Variants (British Army)

Posted: 11 Feb 2019, 08:25
by RetroSicotte
It is indeed for Spike, yeah.

Re: CRV(T) Armoured Vehicle Variants (British Army)

Posted: 11 Feb 2019, 08:25
by Lord Jim
Interesting, I suppose when you r forces are so small, adopting a few new vehicles and a new weapon system don't have a major impact, thanks for the video. Watching all the way through it looks like Latvia as dumped the majority of its soviet era equipment, They seem to have adopted the FN MAG/M240 as well as the M2 Browning. Which of the Baltics bought a number of Boxer IFVs?

Re: CRV(T) Armoured Vehicle Variants (British Army)

Posted: 11 Feb 2019, 08:45
by ArmChairCivvy
Lord Jim wrote: adopting a few new vehicles and a new weapon system don't have a major impact

They got a whole family and loadsa compatible spares
- would not be surprised if they also got an option to buy our whole Rarden rounds stock... in a couple of years

Spike they already had; whether the launcher arm was part of UK refit or not? Seems to go with good optics, either way

Re: CRV(T) Armoured Vehicle Variants (British Army)

Posted: 12 Feb 2019, 19:54
by jimthelad
It would be good to keep a few Scimitar 2 for the Air Assault Bgde. I dont know if we have Lapes still but they we great to have along when I was in.

Re: CRV(T) Armoured Vehicle Variants (British Army)

Posted: 12 Feb 2019, 20:05
by mr.fred
ArmChairCivvy wrote:
Lord Jim wrote: adopting a few new vehicles and a new weapon system don't have a major impact

They got a whole family and loadsa compatible spares
- would not be surprised if they also got an option to buy our whole Rarden rounds stock... in a couple of years

Spike they already had; whether the launcher arm was part of UK refit or not? Seems to go with good optics, either way


What are you guys talking about when you say ‘launcher arm’.
I see a tripod on the back of two of the Spartans, one with a missile and one without, but that’s just a standard tripod.
There’s a mechanism alongside the Commander’s cupola, but that’s a machine gun mount.
Image
Or perhaps an arm rest.

Re: CRV(T) Armoured Vehicle Variants (British Army)

Posted: 12 Feb 2019, 20:44
by RunningStrong
It wasn't hard to Google that CVRT would have Spike.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&source= ... 0569879076

Re: CRV(T) Armoured Vehicle Variants (British Army)

Posted: 12 Feb 2019, 23:01
by Lord Jim
mr.fred wrote:
ArmChairCivvy wrote:
Lord Jim wrote: adopting a few new vehicles and a new weapon system don't have a major impact

They got a whole family and loadsa compatible spares
- would not be surprised if they also got an option to buy our whole Rarden rounds stock... in a couple of years

Spike they already had; whether the launcher arm was part of UK refit or not? Seems to go with good optics, either way


What are you guys talking about when you say ‘launcher arm’.
I see a tripod on the back of two of the Spartans, one with a missile and one without, but that’s just a standard tripod.
There’s a mechanism alongside the Commander’s cupola, but that’s a machine gun mount.
Image
Or perhaps an arm rest.


Closely looking at the video you are right, that is the mount for the MAG, though there is nothing stopping the Latvians from mounting Spike either on a simple launcher or something like we did with the MCT back in the day.

Re: CRV(T) Armoured Vehicle Variants (British Army)

Posted: 13 Feb 2019, 08:31
by ArmChairCivvy
This is of more than passing interest to us as well. The emerging Latvian mech bde and the existing Lithuanian one will be under "the Danish Division" - aptly named as they only have one bde, but that one has quite a bit of fighting power
- our DefSec has talked about increasing integration with the Danish army, though he wasn't specific about the context (this mentioned division vs. EFP in Estonia?)