UK Defence Forum

Ron5 wrote:Ha ha.

Very close to where I live, the freeway for a short way down to the boarder with Mexico, is marked in kilometers. I don't know what bright spark in the highway dept thought that was a good idea because it confuses the heck out of us locals. And only the freeway, local roads are 100% in miles.

Wait, only in kilometers or miles AND kilometers? Why would they mark it just in kilometers?

abc123 wrote:

Ron5 wrote:Ha ha.

Very close to where I live, the freeway for a short way down to the boarder with Mexico, is marked in kilometers. I don't know what bright spark in the highway dept thought that was a good idea because it confuses the heck out of us locals. And only the freeway, local roads are 100% in miles.

Wait, only in kilometers or miles AND kilometers? Why would they mark it just in kilometers?

wonder what measurement system we'll have in 5 years time

Kilometres to miles is divide figure by 8 and then multiply by 5. Gives a pretty accurate conversion. Not sure doing more complex sums/long distance is a good idea whilst you're driving though!

marktigger wrote:

Lord Jim wrote:The Merlin/CROWSNEST is not a swing role platform, it required major work to remove and install new terminals etc., and this will probably done ashore during maintenance. It can be done on deployment I am sure but I doubt it will unless absolutely necessary And I doubt spare full sets will be carried aboard, rather the planned spare parts inventory.

interesting when i talked with a couple of HM2 crews they are under the impression the conversion can be done at sea to any merlin and the consoles can be taken out and replaced. and its a plug in and play system

They are correct.

abc123 wrote:

Ron5 wrote:Ha ha.

Very close to where I live, the freeway for a short way down to the boarder with Mexico, is marked in kilometers. I don't know what bright spark in the highway dept thought that was a good idea because it confuses the heck out of us locals. And only the freeway, local roads are 100% in miles.

Wait, only in kilometers or miles AND kilometers? Why would they mark it just in kilometers?

I told you it makes no sense, it's just km's. Suddenly starts as you leave Tucson and continues to the border.

Locals either ignore the signs or divide by 2 to get miles. Close enough.

Ron5 wrote:

abc123 wrote:

Ron5 wrote:Ha ha.

Very close to where I live, the freeway for a short way down to the boarder with Mexico, is marked in kilometers. I don't know what bright spark in the highway dept thought that was a good idea because it confuses the heck out of us locals. And only the freeway, local roads are 100% in miles.

Wait, only in kilometers or miles AND kilometers? Why would they mark it just in kilometers?

I told you it makes no sense, it's just km's. Suddenly starts as you leave Tucson and continues to the border.

Locals either ignore the signs or divide by 2 to get miles. Close enough.

Yes, very weird indeed. I could understand paralel signs in kilometers and miles, but not this.

One mile is 1,6 kilometers?

If CROWSNEST is plug and play then fantastic, but it will be the first plug and play system I know of that doesn't have the owner spending hours on the phone to the manufacturers customer help line trying to get the thing to work.

If anyone is interested, Air International magazine has a good article on crowsnest. From project inception through to planned deployment.

Same mag also has an article on P-8, including RAF procurement lots and that we would get our allies to help out with air refuelling if it's need (author didn't think much about this idea).

Just wondering how much difference if negligible the updated Thales / searchwater radar and mission system is over the old one ,don't suppose they going to tell anybody either lol.

Great pictures. It is a lot bigger than I thought, still thinking it was a couple of pods attached to the sides of the Merlin that could easily be swapped out. It now looks like there will have to be a dedicated AEW&C flights on the Carriers, with no real ability to swap out the missions systems whilst embarked.

Theoretically, the Crowsnest kit can then be installed in any Merlin in a process that should take around 24 hours, either ashore at RNAS Culdrose or in the spacious hangar of the QE class aircraft carriers. A Merlin changing from the anti-submarine role to ASaC will have its dipping sonar, sonobuoy carousel and ASW consoles removed before the ASaC equipment is added. It is expected that between 6 and 8 Merlins will have the ASaC kit fitted at any one time, with spares available at sea should an ASaC Merlin become unserviceable or lost. This appears to offer some useful flexibility as the carriers will need continuous ASaC capability most of the time. Unfortunately switching precious ASaC platforms to ASW (or vice versa) is far from ideal. The Merlin may have lower maintenance requirements than the Sea King, but 13 aircraft are being replaced by 6-8 kits fitted to aircraft in the existing fleet, a further significant and unwelcome fall in the total number of available airframes.

Lord Jim wrote: still thinking it was a couple of pods attached to the sides of the Merlin that could easily be swapped out

That was the competing solution

Ianmb17 wrote: ASW consoles removed before the ASaC equipment is added.

I thought there was an initiative for the consoles to be able to do both "duties" so less swapping out?

Ianmb17 wrote:significant and unwelcome fall in the total number of available airframes.

Clearly a pointer to having one carrier at sea at a time, and when the other will need to sail as part of the amph. group it will, in the main, stay under the same protective umbrella.

ArmChairCivvy wrote:That was the competing solution

That explains the vague images in the back of my memory. Cheers.

From what I have read there will be around four deployed on the operational carrier and two or three ashore for training. All Crowsnest will be under a single squadron, though the airframes of the whole Merlin HM2 fleet are pooled.

Thanks for sharing, Been wondering on the progress of crowsnest for a while, wonder if she will join the Westland 19 mission? with the F35....

(Tony Osborne @Rotorfocus) 4 April 2019

I saw an artice in some Spanish naval forum ( Foro Naval ) about problems with testing of Crowsnest. Something like that the radar system is too sensitive to use. It doesn't seem as too realistic to me, but does anyone has any more informations?

Just erase the contract, and go back to the second (and only other bidder)
- err, that was done once already, though never explained as to 'why' and, actually, they went back to the winner
- and here we are, now, three years behind

ArmChairCivvy wrote:Just erase the contract, and go back to the second (and only other bidder)
- err, that was done once already, though never explained as to 'why' and, actually, they went back to the winner
- and here we are, now, three years behind

Good thing we went with the simple OTS solution... Unlike the simple OTS Vigilance pod.

How long has Italy been operating their AEW Merlins?

Jensy wrote:

ArmChairCivvy wrote:Just erase the contract, and go back to the second (and only other bidder)
- err, that was done once already, though never explained as to 'why' and, actually, they went back to the winner
- and here we are, now, three years behind

Good thing we went with the simple OTS solution... Unlike the simple OTS Vigilance pod.

How long has Italy been operating their AEW Merlins?

It obviously isn't so simple after all...

Italians, for allmost 20 years. But I heard that they aren't too satisfied with their solution.

Parliamentary written answers 23rd Jan 2020 :-

Asked by Mr Stephen Morgan
(Portsmouth South)
[N]
Asked on: 20 January 2020
Ministry of Defence
Early Warning Systems
5522
To ask the Secretary of State for Defence, recent assessment he has made of the effect of potential delays to the Crowsnest radar system on the ability of Carrier Strike to operate (a) safely and (b) effectively.
A
Answered by: James Heappey
Answered on: 23 January 2020

The Department's approach to capability delivery places safety foremost, through strict compliance to policy, regulation and certification requirements. There are regular updates on the progress of the CROWSNEST programme. The schedule provides an incremental build-up of CROWSNEST to support Initial Operating Capability for Carrier Strike in December 2020 and the inaugural Carrier Strike Group deployment in 2021.

jonas wrote: Initial Operating Capability for Carrier Strike in December 2020

Sounds OK
... though the rst of the answer does not really link up with the bottom line (deliverable i Dec).

I read on another blog that the Italian AEW Merlins don't work and are sitting in a hangar. I have no idea if that is true or not.

Also read someplace that the 6 month or so Crowsnest slippage is due to software delays. Not sure what all the excitement is about, seems they have time to be there for the carrier operational debut.

Also surprised at the love for the losing Lockheed Crowsnest entry. Looked crap to me and chances of it being ready by now? And don't forget, Lockheed (albeit a different part) recommended against it!

Ron5 wrote:Also surprised at the love for the losing Lockheed Crowsnest entry. Looked crap to me and chances of it being ready by now? And don't forget, Lockheed (albeit a different part) recommended against it!

That's the danger of a Chinese wall. You can't make rational, highly biased choices for your own corporate benefit.

At the time I thought the flexibility of the Vigilance pod to go on anything from a Hercules or A400m to a V-22 was more attractive than the Thales offering. Not much love for it beyond that and I doubt it would ever been fitted to anything other than a Merlin.

That said, if it were compatible with the Mk3/4 commando Merlins, not just the HM2s that could potentially have kept the ASW helo fleet focused on its main task. Though of course we'd then probably be short of cabs for the Royal Marines...