Exactly. The intention is put a new CIWS in Atlantico, even a Sea Ceptor is beeing considered. The most probable is the Rheinmetall Oerlikon Millennium Gun 35mmArmChairCivvy wrote:- thx Brasil; so where the Phalanx mounts were have been left as they were (but w/o anything)?Brasil wrote:They are the original 30mm DS30M Mk2. The same mounted on our Amazonas class (based on your River class)
Ocean Class Helicopter Carrier (LPH) (1998-2018) (ex RN)
Re: Ocean Class Helicopter Carrier (LPH) (1998-2018) (ex RN)
Re: Ocean Class Helicopter Carrier (LPH) (1998-2018) (ex RN)
In operations, before this eventBrasil wrote:A140 Atlantico arrives the first time in the state of São Paulo - Brazil. In the port of Santos - São Paulo
Re: Ocean Class Helicopter Carrier (LPH) (1998-2018) (ex RN)
Her new life:
"Operation Joanne D'arc" With LPD Tonnerre (French Navy)
More operations, elevator and hangar
Operation with French Navy (LPD Tonnerre). Cross Deck Gazelle + Alouette
"Operation Joanne D'arc" With LPD Tonnerre (French Navy)
More operations, elevator and hangar
Operation with French Navy (LPD Tonnerre). Cross Deck Gazelle + Alouette
Re: Ocean Class Helicopter Carrier (LPH) (1998-2018) (ex RN)
(Roberto Smera) 9th September 2019
Google translation:
For the festivities of September 7th, Independence Day, we had the honour of receiving in Santos the imposing “Atlântico” Multi-Purpose Helicopter Carrier, recently incorporated into the Brazilian Squadron. More than 200 metres long and a crew of 303 military, the "Atlantic" set sail today with several sailors on the deck, a scene that I was delighted to capture with my drone. Looking to explore new and unseen angles of the ship, I planned a lower flight, in order to get better approach of the bow, stern, edges and other equipment. It is with immense honour and satisfaction that I continue to spread the work of our glorious navy. Welcome back, Atlantic. The good Brazilian people are proud of our FFAA.
Re: Ocean Class Helicopter Carrier (LPH) (1998-2018) (ex RN)
Well this would certainly be an unexpected development for Brazil. They have a real knack for fixed wing naval aviation on a budget.
With Watchkeeper still failing to deliver it's promised capability, I wouldn't put to much hope in the Royal Navy wanting to jump on the programme. That said, we've got a lot of deck to use.
"Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the War Room!" - Dr. Strangelove (1964)
Re: Ocean Class Helicopter Carrier (LPH) (1998-2018) (ex RN)
Having a readily deployable Soft "Crash" Barrier/Net to catch a UAV on landing n the flight deck could be something to look at on the QEs. Using a JATO style launch would certainly get one in the air, maybe an alternative launch platform for the new Protectors, to allow their use when there are no friendly launch sites within effective range of an objective. Given the emphasis on ISTAR capabilities the next review seems to want to focus on, adding an additional capability in this area to the Carriers might make them seem even more relevant to certain people in positions of power. Now I wonder if those AEW pods that lost the CROWSNEST contract could be fitted to a Protector?
- Tempest414
- Senior Member
- Posts: 5619
- Joined: 04 Jan 2018, 23:39
Re: Ocean Class Helicopter Carrier (LPH) (1998-2018) (ex RN)
I am still shocked that Brazil did not buy HMS Ark Royal and say 20 Harriers and just dump there old carrier and skyhawks
Re: Ocean Class Helicopter Carrier (LPH) (1998-2018) (ex RN)
Yep. Especially because they had money then. But then they had fantasies about new CATOBAR carrier from France.Tempest414 wrote:I am still shocked that Brazil did not buy HMS Ark Royal and say 20 Harriers and just dump there old carrier and skyhawks
Fortune favors brave sir, said Carrot cheerfully.
What's her position about heavily armed, well prepared and overmanned armies?
Oh, noone's ever heard of Fortune favoring them, sir.
According to General Tacticus, it's because they favor themselves…
What's her position about heavily armed, well prepared and overmanned armies?
Oh, noone's ever heard of Fortune favoring them, sir.
According to General Tacticus, it's because they favor themselves…
Re: Ocean Class Helicopter Carrier (LPH) (1998-2018) (ex RN)
Seemed a little far-fetched but Elbit don't usually come up with many fantasy concepts. If they are confident they can get a Hermes 450 off ex-Ocean's deck, it's shouldn't be unsurpassable to get a Watchkeeper off a QEC.Lord Jim wrote:Given the emphasis on ISTAR capabilities the next review seems to want to focus on, adding an additional capability in this area to the Carriers might make them seem even more relevant to certain people in positions of power. Now I wonder if those AEW pods that lost the CROWSNEST contract could be fitted to a Protector?
There was a carrier version of the Reaper/Protector with folding wings and reinforced airframe but it got binned. I'd say starting small with carrier based UAVs seems wise until we know more about their potential operation.
Now on the other hand I remember some Army general talk of arming Watchkeeper with Martlet... Wonder how many they could carry.
They 'just didn't give a Foch'..... Sorry couldn't resist.Tempest414 wrote:I am still shocked that Brazil did not buy HMS Ark Royal and say 20 Harriers and just dump there old carrier and skyhawks
Always been surprised by that, especially when they then proceeded to buy Ocean right afterwards. I suppose the attraction of utilising their existing A-4 facilities and expertise seemed better than introducing a wholly new type. Though they then bought prehistoric S-2 Trackers for AEW.
Can't imagine the Argies would have been particularly amused, seeing an Invincible Class sailing around their neighborhood with Harriers on the deck and defended by Type 22s!
"Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the War Room!" - Dr. Strangelove (1964)
Re: Ocean Class Helicopter Carrier (LPH) (1998-2018) (ex RN)
I always come back to it but if you want capable UAVs that can operate off the QEs the these are the answer for me -Lord Jim wrote:Having a readily deployable Soft "Crash" Barrier/Net to catch a UAV on landing n the flight deck could be something to look at on the QEs. Using a JATO style launch would certainly get one in the air, maybe an alternative launch platform for the new Protectors, to allow their use when there are no friendly launch sites within effective range of an objective. Given the emphasis on ISTAR capabilities the next review seems to want to focus on, adding an additional capability in this area to the Carriers might make them seem even more relevant to certain people in positions of power. Now I wonder if those AEW pods that lost the CROWSNEST contract could be fitted to a Protector?
https://www.naval-technology.com/projec ... ft-system/
The Bell V-247 Vigilant is a new multi-role tilt-rotor unmanned aerial vehicle (UAV) being developed by Textron subsidiary Bell Helicopter to meet the future requirements of the US Marine Corps (USMC).
Bell Helicopter revealed the design of the V-247 Vigilant tilt-rotor UAV in September 2016. The aircraft is designed to fit the capabilities drafted in the 2016 Marine Corps Aviation Plan. The V-247 Vigilant is expected to enter production phase by 2023.
The Bell V-247 Vigilant can be deployed in a range of missions including electronic warfare, airborne early warning (AEW), an escort for V-22 / V-280 tilt-rotor aircraft, command, control, communications, and computers, intelligence, surveillance and reconnaissance (C4ISR), persistent fire support and tactical resupply.
- ArmChairCivvy
- Senior Member
- Posts: 16312
- Joined: 05 May 2015, 21:34
Re: Ocean Class Helicopter Carrier (LPH) (1998-2018) (ex RN)
The army has wasted unimaginable sums on that projectJensy wrote:shouldn't be unsurpassable to get a Watchkeeper off a QEC.
... now it's the navy's turn
Yeah, bcz the carriers can do so much better; so they turned to a vertical take-off, long range, surveillance and targeting only alternative... that can take off from any ship (from LCS/ frigate up)Jensy wrote:carrier version of the Reaper/Protector with folding wings and reinforced airframe but it got binned.
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)
Re: Ocean Class Helicopter Carrier (LPH) (1998-2018) (ex RN)
Hey don't blame me, I'd have gone with developing the BAE Mantis concept!ArmChairCivvy wrote:The army has wasted unimaginable sums on that projectJensy wrote:shouldn't be unsurpassable to get a Watchkeeper off a QEC.
... now it's the navy's turn
Still you can't trust these Army types with a sophisticated bit of kit, which the IDF basically fly from hillsides in [redacted].
Time to dust off the Skyhook plans?
"Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the War Room!" - Dr. Strangelove (1964)
Re: Ocean Class Helicopter Carrier (LPH) (1998-2018) (ex RN)
And the price. The Foch was practically "donated" to the Brazilian navy. 12 million dollars.Jensy wrote:They 'just didn't give a Foch'..... Sorry couldn't resist.Tempest414 wrote:I am still shocked that Brazil did not buy HMS Ark Royal and say 20 Harriers and just dump there old carrier and skyhawks
Always been surprised by that, especially when they then proceeded to buy Ocean right afterwards. I suppose the attraction of utilising their existing A-4 facilities and expertise seemed better than introducing a wholly new type. Though they then bought prehistoric S-2 Trackers for AEW.
Can't imagine the Argies would have been particularly amused, seeing an Invincible Class sailing around their neighborhood with Harriers on the deck and defended by Type 22s!
Re: Ocean Class Helicopter Carrier (LPH) (1998-2018) (ex RN)
How much did the last refit for Ocean cost the MoD and how much did Brazil but it for again?
Re: Ocean Class Helicopter Carrier (LPH) (1998-2018) (ex RN)
I thought Brazil payed for the last refit before handoverLord Jim wrote:How much did the last refit for Ocean cost the MoD and how much did Brazil but it for again?
Re: Ocean Class Helicopter Carrier (LPH) (1998-2018) (ex RN)
I believe they paid for the refit to remove certain systems and install others once they had bought it, but Ocean had just finished a major refit and overhaul which it had still been ongoing when talks with Brazil began as far as I remember. As per usual we sold a valuable piece of kit at Aldi prices.
Re: Ocean Class Helicopter Carrier (LPH) (1998-2018) (ex RN)
(ÁREA MILITAR BRASILEIRA) 19th July 2020
Drone footage of ex-HMS Ocean - now serving in Brazilian Navy as PHM Atlântico
Re: Ocean Class Helicopter Carrier (LPH) (1998-2018) (ex RN)
Nice looking Littoral Strike Ship there.....SKB wrote:
(ÁREA MILITAR BRASILEIRA) 19th July 2020
Drone footage of ex-HMS Ocean - now serving in Brazilian Navy as PHM Atlântico
Will be interesting how much service life the Brazilians can eke out of her.
"Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the War Room!" - Dr. Strangelove (1964)
Re: Ocean Class Helicopter Carrier (LPH) (1998-2018) (ex RN)
Live from the ex Ocean:
Check out the show directly from the Multi-Purpose Aerodrome Ship "Atlântico", the flagship of the Brazilian Navy.
Check out the show directly from the Multi-Purpose Aerodrome Ship "Atlântico", the flagship of the Brazilian Navy.
Re: Ocean Class Helicopter Carrier (LPH) (1998-2018) (ex RN)
The Atlantic Multi-Purpose Helicopter Carrier - A140 is renamed Atlantic Multi-Purpose Aerodrome Ship
Atlantic Helicopter Carrier is now Multi-Purpose Aerodrome Ship
November 26, 2020 7211 266
The Atlantic Multi-Purpose Helicopter Carrier - A140 is renamed Atlantic Multi-Purpose Aerodrome Ship
In November, through the Ordinance of the Navy Commander, the Atlantic Multi-Purpose Helicopter Carrier had its name changed to the Atlantic Multi-Purpose Aerodrome Ship.
Such change in the type of ship is due to the fact that the environment has the ability to operate in its deck with remotely piloted aircraft as well as with turboprop aircraft for vertical landing.
Brazilian Navy Ordinance No. 328 / MB of 12 November 2020 modified Ordinance No. 190 / MB / 2018 to change the name of the Multi-Purpose Helicopter Carrier (PHM) “ATLÂNTICO” which is now called: Atlantic Multi-Purpose Aerodrome Ship (NAM “Atlântico”).
Two other changes were made:
2nd Classify the NAM “Atlântico” as a 1st Class ship.
Art. 3 Subordinate the “Atlantic” NAM to the Naval Operations Command.
Art. 4º To delegate competence to the Commander of Naval Operations to transfer the subordination of NAM “Atlântico” to the Commander in Chief of the Squadron. ” (NR)
Atlantic Helicopter Carrier is now Multi-Purpose Aerodrome Ship
November 26, 2020 7211 266
The Atlantic Multi-Purpose Helicopter Carrier - A140 is renamed Atlantic Multi-Purpose Aerodrome Ship
In November, through the Ordinance of the Navy Commander, the Atlantic Multi-Purpose Helicopter Carrier had its name changed to the Atlantic Multi-Purpose Aerodrome Ship.
Such change in the type of ship is due to the fact that the environment has the ability to operate in its deck with remotely piloted aircraft as well as with turboprop aircraft for vertical landing.
Brazilian Navy Ordinance No. 328 / MB of 12 November 2020 modified Ordinance No. 190 / MB / 2018 to change the name of the Multi-Purpose Helicopter Carrier (PHM) “ATLÂNTICO” which is now called: Atlantic Multi-Purpose Aerodrome Ship (NAM “Atlântico”).
Two other changes were made:
2nd Classify the NAM “Atlântico” as a 1st Class ship.
Art. 3 Subordinate the “Atlantic” NAM to the Naval Operations Command.
Art. 4º To delegate competence to the Commander of Naval Operations to transfer the subordination of NAM “Atlântico” to the Commander in Chief of the Squadron. ” (NR)
Re: Ocean Class Helicopter Carrier (LPH) (1998-2018) (ex RN)
Fascinating and great to see Brazil getting good use out of her. Obrigado for sharing!Brasil wrote: The Atlantic Multi-Purpose Helicopter Carrier - A140 is renamed Atlantic Multi-Purpose Aerodrome Ship
Atlantic Helicopter Carrier is now Multi-Purpose Aerodrome Ship
November 26, 2020 7211 266
The Atlantic Multi-Purpose Helicopter Carrier - A140 is renamed Atlantic Multi-Purpose Aerodrome Ship
In November, through the Ordinance of the Navy Commander, the Atlantic Multi-Purpose Helicopter Carrier had its name changed to the Atlantic Multi-Purpose Aerodrome Ship.
Such change in the type of ship is due to the fact that the environment has the ability to operate in its deck with remotely piloted aircraft as well as with turboprop aircraft for vertical landing.
Brazilian Navy Ordinance No. 328 / MB of 12 November 2020 modified Ordinance No. 190 / MB / 2018 to change the name of the Multi-Purpose Helicopter Carrier (PHM) “ATLÂNTICO” which is now called: Atlantic Multi-Purpose Aerodrome Ship (NAM “Atlântico”).
Two other changes were made:
2nd Classify the NAM “Atlântico” as a 1st Class ship.
Art. 3 Subordinate the “Atlantic” NAM to the Naval Operations Command.
Art. 4º To delegate competence to the Commander of Naval Operations to transfer the subordination of NAM “Atlântico” to the Commander in Chief of the Squadron. ” (NR)
Clearly the arresting gear isn't going to trap anything too large (looks like Hermes 450s - no need for Watchkeeper spec over the ocean), however it shows what could be achieved on the QEC with its far larger deck area, with regards UAVs and possibly something like a BN Defender....
"Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the War Room!" - Dr. Strangelove (1964)
Re: Ocean Class Helicopter Carrier (LPH) (1998-2018) (ex RN)
Time for something like an OV-10 Bronco to make a come back?Jensy wrote:
Clearly the arresting gear isn't going to trap anything too large (looks like Hermes 450s - no need for Watchkeeper spec over the ocean), however it shows what could be achieved on the QEC with its far larger deck area, with regards UAVs and possibly something like a BN Defender....
Re: Ocean Class Helicopter Carrier (LPH) (1998-2018) (ex RN)
There was talk of Boeing reopening the line for new build OV-10X Super Bronco at the height of the war on ISIS, don’t think it was ever really serious proposal, but an OV-10X wouldn’t need arresting wires as the US trialed OV-10 off the USS John F Kennedy in 68 using only the recovery line for take offs/landings, can’t see it having problems using the centre line off the QE’s in need beDahedd wrote:Time for something like an OV-10 Bronco to make a come back?Jensy wrote:
Clearly the arresting gear isn't going to trap anything too large (looks like Hermes 450s - no need for Watchkeeper spec over the ocean), however it shows what could be achieved on the QEC with its far larger deck area, with regards UAVs and possibly something like a BN Defender....
I think it would be easier to use an existing aircraft which might not need arresting wires either a AT-6B Wolverine or A-29 Super Tucano