Type 31 Frigate (Inspiration Class) [News Only]

[Repulse]

ArmChairCivvy, if the RN ditched the SSNs and SSBNs there could be 40 more IHs... doesn’t make it the right thing to do though.

[Ron5]

Annual GDP [+] 2017 324,872M.$ vs. 2,622,434M.$ 2017 Annual GDP [+]
Defence Expenditure (M.$) [+] 2017 3,811.2 vs. 47,364.1 2017 Defence Expenditure (M.$) [+]

GDP comparison to us 12% and defence expenditure 8% => I round the composite index to 10%

Hence, we should have, in our surface fleet
- 10 times as many general purpose, frigate sized vessels, compared their Absalons
- and 10 times as many ABM capable ships, compared to their IHs.

No doubt that the unit price comparisons have not been like for like, but something has still been done right... e.g. a centralised/ nationalised yard for the military fitting out (and testing of the results), while competing the building of the hulls and fitting for propulsion and basic navigation?

The Danish yard that built the IH's went bankrupt soon afterwards. So not exactly a procurement methodology worth copying.

[The Armchair Soldier]

Can we get back to Type 31 news discussion please, thank you.

[SKB]

News.

[jimthelad]

Where are the SSM launchers?!

[Opinion3]

Where are the fantasy threads??????

Two of the best threads on the whole forum

[The Armchair Soldier]

Where are the fantasy threads??????

Two of the best threads on the whole forum

viewtopic.php?f=39&p=76102#p76102

[Ron5]

News.

I don't think I've seen that image before. It's Arrowhead 120 so I wonder if this is confirmation that Babcock's have reverted back to this design as their entry?

[Poiuytrewq]

News.

I don't think I've seen that image before. It's Arrowhead 120 so I wonder if this is confirmation that Babcock's have reverted back to this design as their entry?

It looks like Arrowhead 140 to me.

[Aethulwulf]

News.

I don't think I've seen that image before. It's Arrowhead 120 so I wonder if this is confirmation that Babcock's have reverted back to this design as their entry?

Looks like the Arrowhead 140 to me...

...But the news was about Defence Minister answering questions in the House of Lords. I've not seen any TV footage, but I'm willing to bet a large sum he didn't hand out any pretty pictures during the session. This picture would have been added by NavyLookout.

[Ron5]

News.

I don't think I've seen that image before. It's Arrowhead 120 so I wonder if this is confirmation that Babcock's have reverted back to this design as their entry?

It looks like Arrowhead 140 to me.

I think you may be correct. The new perspective is throwing me.

[donald_of_tokyo]

"Government reiterate Type 31e frigate plans" from UKDJ.

https://ukdefencejournal.org.uk/governm ... ate-plans/

Nothing new, but the contract notice would be interesting.

An MoD spokesperson said that a prior information notice has been issued to industry and a new contract notice has been issued.

I am not registered, and not yet read it.
https://www.defenceonline.co.uk/2018/08 ... hipacq182/

[Tempest414]

may be just slip up but interesting to me was

( There have been no changes in our plans to procure a first batch of 5 type 31 frigates )

[SDL]

when the T31 was announced, i thought the wording then was 'At Least' 5 Frigates...?

[ArmChairCivvy]

( There have been no changes in our plans to procure a first batch of 5 type 31 frigates )[/quote]

when the T31 was announced, i thought the wording then was 'At Least' 5 Frigates...?

The latter is true; how any "batches" might be divided up as for numbers... is mute
- I myself am a "great believer" in that it will, indeed, be batches
- that being the reason why so "little" was mandated, and so much was in the "desirable" boxes

[donald_of_tokyo]

If you cut 2 T26, you can build 6 T31 with no additional money.
Increased number of escorts?

[Ron5]

when the T31 was announced, i thought the wording then was 'At Least' 5 Frigates...?

No. It was always 5 ships for a budget of 1.25b.

[ArmChairCivvy]

'At Least' 5 Frigates...?

5 ships for a budget of 1.25b.

to begin with

Double Bingo!

[Phil Sayers]

If you cut 2 T26, you can build 6 T31 with no additional money.
Increased number of escorts?

To be fair if cutting two T26 meant a guaranteed order of ten to twelve T31 (preferably divided roughly in half between an austere patrol version and a better equipped ASW version) I wouldn't think of it as being a bad plan. Escort numbers back up to 22-24, still capable of deploying a world class task force and more vessels available for routine taskings or just to relieve the long term build up of family life, maintenance etc pressures that come with having too few vessels to do all they are asked to do.

However I fully anticipate that there would be no actual (or at least meaningful) guarantee of ten to twelve T31s in the event two T26s are axed and question marks over whether the RN could actually crew more escorts so this is not something I am actually advocating.

[dmereifield]

If you cut 2 T26, you can build 6 T31 with no additional money.
Increased number of escorts?

To be fair if cutting two T26 meant a guaranteed order of ten to twelve T31 (preferably divided roughly in half between an austere patrol version and a better equipped ASW version) I wouldn't think of it as being a bad plan. Escort numbers back up to 22-24, still capable of deploying a world class task force and more vessels available for routine taskings or just to relieve the long term build up of family life, maintenance etc pressures that come with having too few vessels to do all they are asked to do.

However I fully anticipate that there would be no actual (or at least meaningful) guarantee of ten to twelve T31s in the event two T26s are axed and question marks over whether the RN could actually crew more escorts so this is not something I am 1actually advocating.

Of course not, more likely we cut the last 2 T26 and order 3 T31. HMG still get to claim an increase in "escorts" and also get to save about £500 million. Of course the batch of 3 T31 would need to be credible (as much as they can be) 2nd rate ASW frigates, and I suppose BAE would have to get workshare from them (or something else) to make up for the loss of the 2 T26....

[jonas]

I keep returning to this thread in particular as it is supposed to be for T31 NEWS. How many times does the Mod have to keep asking people to post their speculative opinions on the other thread.

It is frustrating when one is expecting some genuine news, only to be greeted with more of the same old wishfull thinking.

[Tempest414]

What is needed is a Type 31 general discussion thread clearly a lot of people want to talk around the options of type 31 and this is why it was a mistake to move the fantasy thread out of the RN section of the forum

[donald_of_tokyo]

May be just use the escort thread. T26 news, T45 news, T31 news, and the escort thread.

My original post was on the new ukdj article, so, it is new = Today. And each and every time we got such news, we shift to other threads, at some moment.

[Caribbean]

@All - probably best to double-post, then, into both news and discussion threads, leaving the news thread more as a reference thread, which can be useful when you are researching when events happened. Comments on the news thread should be limited to updates/ corrections/ requests for clarification etc on the news item.

I think that I agree with the general consensus that moving the fantasy thread was a poor decision (sorry mods, I think you got that wrong). All that is likely to occur is that more "speculative" stuff gets posted into the news or general discussion threads.

It should be reasonable to expect general discussion about established programs on the relevant escorts/ amphibs general threads and also to have a "speculative" thread for discussion of ideas, designs and assorted flights of fancy under the Fantasy label (though I would prefer something more like "Future Speculation" or "Future Fleet Ideas" as a title - you don't have to read it if you don't like it!).

[abc123]

I keep returning to this thread in particular as it is supposed to be for T31 NEWS. How many times does the Mod have to keep asking people to post their speculative opinions on the other thread.

It is frustrating when one is expecting some genuine news, only to be greeted with more of the same old wishfull thinking.

But why? I don't think that discussion about options of T31 development is really for "Fantasy" thread? It isn't that T31 ( that should enter service in 5 years ) is in the same class like the RN Space Destroyers...