Queen Elizabeth Class Aircraft Carriers - News and Discussion

Contains threads on Royal Navy equipment of the past, present and future.
Timmymagic
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Re: Queen Elizabeth Class Aircraft Carriers - News and Discussion

Post by Timmymagic »

ArmChairCivvy wrote:The RN has been anxious to further MV-22 integration on the QEC ships to establish the Osprey as a credible maritime intra-theatre lift solution."
Definitely a 'view' from Janes.
But I guess we must see the MV-22 trials not in the light of a future buy by the RN (because its just not going to happen given the EP and V-22 production line) but as a necessary part of USMC joint operations when they are aboard. The RN might have heavy RAS aboard the FSS to transfer UK owned F135 engines over to QE if necessary, but the USMC may indeed choose to re-supply its units aboard QE in the manner to which they are accustomed.

PhillyJ
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Re: Queen Elizabeth Class Aircraft Carriers - News and Discussion

Post by PhillyJ »

inch wrote:Will we get to hear if new carrier will do a higher top speed dash than qe on her trials or will it be all hush hush?
Not sure, but she hit 19.1 knots on the 25th according to MarineTraffic. If I hear anything I'll certainly pass it on! :shh:

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SKB
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Re: Queen Elizabeth Class Aircraft Carriers - News and Discussion

Post by SKB »

PoW today:


15:30 - PoW is currently just south of Kirkcaldy at anchorage K7 in the Forth. 0 knots. Water depth 22m.
On AIS, theres a vessel named QNLZ PTB 2 near her. (Passenger Transfer Boat).

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inch
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Re: Queen Elizabeth Class Aircraft Carriers - News and Discussion

Post by inch »

Cheers phillyj

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: Queen Elizabeth Class Aircraft Carriers - News and Discussion

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

Timmymagic wrote:part of USMC joint operations when they are aboard
Agreed. And don't need to be aboard; just in the same area of Ops.
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
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Phil Sayers
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Re: Queen Elizabeth Class Aircraft Carriers - News and Discussion

Post by Phil Sayers »

dmereifield wrote:Do we know anything about squadron sizes yet?
Looking at it purely from the perspective of what would be best to get on to the carriers (i.e not considering RAF requirements, administrative efficiency, deep maintenance requirements etc) I tend to think squadrons of 9 would work best. That way a carrier could carry nine F35s while still being able to support significant amphibious rotary lift in the LPH role, while principally conducting ASW ops in the Atlantic or just for low key (or as low key as a 70k carrier can get...) show the flag deployments.

The main potential advantage is that current plans are for the carrier to routinely carry twelve jets but I would hope that with squadrons of nine the usual complement would become a respectable eighteen. I may well be wrong but am presuming the additional six jets would actually disproportionately increase the offensive firepower available as a large portion of the twelve will have to be, in many situations, earmarked for fleet defence CAP. If twelve is increased to eighteen then it becomes possible to start using ten or more of them offensively. Another advantage is that a 'surge' to having twenty seven on board seems a more realistic scenario than a surge to thirty six and therefore would hopefully happen from time to time whereas thirty six will occur once in a decade, if ever. In a full scale war situation you could still get the thirty six aboard but spread across four squadrons rather than three.

Scimitar54
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Re: Queen Elizabeth Class Aircraft Carriers - News and Discussion

Post by Scimitar54 »

I think you will find that all of the "12" will be for CSG defence. 6 additional F35's will not provide much in the way of Carrier "Strike", or "Enabled Power Projection". :mrgreen:

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Re: Queen Elizabeth Class Aircraft Carriers - News and Discussion

Post by Scimitar54 »

Further to my earlier post:-

In the fullness of time, as UK F35b numbers increase, if the Air Boss and his team of each Carrier do not get sufficient chance to practice operations with 36 x F35 on board, then they will not really be able to operate with this higher number, To be credible, they will have to sometimes operate with the maximum number, or possibly even at an "Overload" number. :mrgreen:

S M H
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Re: Queen Elizabeth Class Aircraft Carriers - News and Discussion

Post by S M H »

Scimitar54 wrote:I think you will find that all of the "12" will be for CSG defence. 6 additional F35's will not provide much in the way of Carrier "Strike", or "Enabled Power Projection".
I suspect that the procurement plan for the F 35 will follow the original planning. When the carriers were started prior to political deferments defence cuts. They would have had the harriers to supplement the F 35 in early years. So keeping with the procurement plan for the F 35 we will have 12 aircraft deployed. The U.S.M.C. making up the second squadron. By the mid 20s the carriers would be able to deploy with two U.K. squadrons. Even in L. P.H. mode there will be fixed wing aircraft deployed. With the present tight procurement costing. (elephant in the room) There will not be sufficient funding to provide two operational squadrons unless we have a U.K. max effort. When we have four operational squadrons 24 aircraft deployments should be the normal.

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SKB
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Re: Queen Elizabeth Class Aircraft Carriers - News and Discussion

Post by SKB »

Image
(@HMSQNLZ) 26 September 2019
@HMSQNLZ wrote:Well #WESTLANT19 can't be all work and no play! Almost a month since we left home, we've earned an afternoon of sport and a BBQ in the sun. At 4 acres, big enough for 3 football pitches, it barely looks like there is anyone on the flight deck! #QNLZatSea #PWLSatSea

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SKB
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Re: Queen Elizabeth Class Aircraft Carriers - News and Discussion

Post by SKB »

Image
Image
Image
Image
(@HMSQNLZ) 27 September 2019
@HMSQNLZ wrote:WESTLANT19 - where you can watch movies on a 40 foot inflatable screen on full blast, without the neighbours complaining! A fantastic Royal Navy night enjoyed by all. Tomorrow, back to the hard work preparing for Lightning.

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SKB
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Re: Queen Elizabeth Class Aircraft Carriers - News and Discussion

Post by SKB »


(QEClassCarriers) 24 September 2019


(QEClassCarriers) 26 September 2019
QEClassCarriers wrote:Departing for sea trials

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SKB
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Re: Queen Elizabeth Class Aircraft Carriers - News and Discussion

Post by SKB »

PoW left Kirkcaldy at midnight for the North Sea.
She was doing 17.2 kts before going off AIS east of the Isle of May at 02:54 BST (01:54 UTC/GMT).

dmereifield
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Re: Queen Elizabeth Class Aircraft Carriers - News and Discussion

Post by dmereifield »

Can anybody tell me what the minimum number of fixed wing aircraft would be to be able to deploy a meaningful strike capability (in addition to CAP)?

16, 18, 20 F35B? More?

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shark bait
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Re: Queen Elizabeth Class Aircraft Carriers - News and Discussion

Post by shark bait »

Would probably need a squadron for CAP and and squadron for attack. I doubt it would be rigid like that in reality, but it would require about 2 squadrons worth of aircraft and crew, so around 20 F35.
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shark bait
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Re: Queen Elizabeth Class Aircraft Carriers - News and Discussion

Post by shark bait »

A QE will be the densest concentration of British air power for a very long time (since the falklands?).

The French manage to pull off a similar feat on their carrier and they don't have the USMC on board. If the Brits want it, it's totally achievable.
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Re: Queen Elizabeth Class Aircraft Carriers - News and Discussion

Post by Repulse »

dmereifield wrote:Can anybody tell me what the minimum number of fixed wing aircraft would be to be able to deploy a meaningful strike capability (in addition to CAP)?

16, 18, 20 F35B? More?
I thought the old Invincible class could operate two harrier squadrons of 9 a/c - one FAA for CAP and another RAF for Strike. Minimum would be the same.
”We have no eternal allies, and we have no perpetual enemies. Our interests are eternal and perpetual, and those interests it is our duty to follow." - Lord Palmerston

RAF>FAN
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Re: Queen Elizabeth Class Aircraft Carriers - News and Discussion

Post by RAF>FAN »

https://navaltoday.com/2019/09/24/first ... ng-trials/

This happened a bit quietly or did i miss something?

SW1
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Re: Queen Elizabeth Class Aircraft Carriers - News and Discussion

Post by SW1 »

shark bait wrote:A QE will be the densest concentration of British air power for a very long time (since the falklands?).
Nope Granby was much larger and there nearly twice as many tornado GR sqn alone then as there is fast jet sqns now.

Nor is there any need to concentrate so much at sea.

Roders96
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Re: Queen Elizabeth Class Aircraft Carriers - News and Discussion

Post by Roders96 »

SW1 wrote: Nor is there any need to concentrate so much at sea.
I know Tobias isn't an Air Chief Marshall but he is a pilot and the lot at RUSI do seem to know a trick or two:

https://rusi.org/rusi-news/two-aircraft ... bal-player

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source= ... 9596401950

From the above two sources we know that:

- in operations over Libya, carrier strike would have been 4 times more efficient
- when it comes to maintaining UK sovereign airfields, operating POW is 50% of the cost of Marham (page 3)

I know there are a lot of other factors to be considered but it must be remembered purse strings are tight and it is rather foolish to throw taxpayers money into the air.

PhillyJ
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Re: Queen Elizabeth Class Aircraft Carriers - News and Discussion

Post by PhillyJ »

SKB wrote:PoW left Kirkcaldy at midnight for the North Sea.
She was doing 17.2 kts before going off AIS east of the Isle of May at 02:54 BST (01:54 UTC/GMT).
Hmm, think I need to speak to my nipper when he is up. According to MarineTraffic PWLS was doing 18kts at 03:38 and then went quiet until 07:03 when she was doing 21 kts but had covered quite a bit of distance...he was on the 4am watch shift. 8-)

PhillyJ
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Re: Queen Elizabeth Class Aircraft Carriers - News and Discussion

Post by PhillyJ »

Well PWLS hit 27.3 kts on the 28th according to MarineTraffic, spoke to my lad last night and they are waiting for a run ashore at Invergordon pretty soon.

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SKB
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Re: Queen Elizabeth Class Aircraft Carriers - News and Discussion

Post by SKB »



Image
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Timmymagic
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Re: Queen Elizabeth Class Aircraft Carriers - News and Discussion

Post by Timmymagic »

Is that a Babcock Offshore helicopter?

I wonder if it was for personnel or cargo?

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SKB
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Re: Queen Elizabeth Class Aircraft Carriers - News and Discussion

Post by SKB »

I think it is. Same type and paintjob style as these. https://www.babcockinternational.com/wh ... l-and-gas/

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