Queen Elizabeth Class Aircraft Carriers - News and Discussion

[SKB]

Can't see the submarine.

[inch]

Wait for the 2 carrier pic now ,well that's what I'm hoping lol , absolutely cracking tho ,shame sub not leading pic but I can absolutely understand that also ,its doing its job not photo time ,well done everybody and a great big thumbs up to the usmc and navy and the Dutch ,true pals indeed

[SKB]

PoW is still in Portsmouth. No public notice of her departure yet.

[The Armchair Soldier]

Video released:



Best birthday present ever. Thanks RN.

[inch]

What's the chances that there getting some real live sub hunting on the exercise with a Russian sub in the area trying to get as much data / signals intel as they can ,well it would make it as realistic as it could possibly get

[bobp]

Us Ambassador pays a visit .......

[BlueD954]

Repeat CSG for Joint Warrior

The Carrier Strike Group includes NATO’s most sophisticated destroyers – the Royal Navy’s Type 45s HMS Diamond and HMS Defender and US Navy Arleigh Burke-class USS The Sullivans as well as frigates HMS Northumberland and HMS Kent from the UK and the Dutch Navy’s HNLMS Evertsen.

Meanwhile, two Royal Fleet Auxiliary ships, RFA Tideforce and RFA Fort Victoria, will supply fuel, food, spares and ammunition, to enabled sustained operations from the sea without host nation support.

[Aethulwulf]

UK to compete future carrier dry dock periods reported by Janes

A series of competitions are to be run for future dry dock periods for the UK Royal Navy’s two Queen Elizabeth-class aircraft carriers.

Giving evidence on 28 September to the UK parliament’s Public Accounts Committee on the progress of the Carrier Strike programme, Sir Simon Bollom, chief executive of Defence Equipment & Support, said there were five contenders for future dry dock work.

“At the moment, I think there are five capabilities in the UK of sufficient size to accept the carrier,” said Bollom. “It is about a six-week maintenance period, every six years. Our plan at the moment is probably to put it out to competition. Not for several years yet. We will do that on a case-by-case basis.”

The first carrier, HMS Queen Elizabeth, underwent its first dry dock period in mid-2019 at Babcock’s No 1 Dry Dock at Rosyth under a GBP5 million (USD6.35 million) contract. This work was carried out five years after the ship was floated out of the same dock, where it was originally assembled.

The second carrier, HMS Prince of Wales, is expected to need a dry dock period in late 2022 or 2023 – some five or six years after being floated out of Rosyth’s No 1 Dock in September 2017 – so a contracting process would need to get under way in 2021.

Bollom did not identify the likely contenders but in addition to Babcock’s Rosyth facility, others expected to be in the running are Harland & Wolff’s facility in Belfast, Able UK’s Seaton Port dry dock, Peel Ports’ Inchgreen Dry Dock in Greenock, and No 5 Dock at Cammell Laird’s Birkenhead site.

[Ron5]

Our plan at the moment is probably to put it out to competition. Not for several years yet. We will do that on a case-by-case basis.”

Great idea, not.

[bobp]

Best birthday present ever. Thanks RN.

Totally off topic- Happy Birthday to you.

[Poiuytrewq]

Bollom did not identify the likely contenders but in addition to Babcock’s Rosyth facility, others expected to be in the running are Harland & Wolff’s facility in Belfast, Able UK’s Seaton Port dry dock, Peel Ports’ Inchgreen Dry Dock in Greenock, and No 5 Dock at Cammell Laird’s Birkenhead site.

I thought he was joking when he said it.

It's not clear that any of the aforementioned yards apart from Rosyth are capable of completing a QE refit satisfactorily without substantial investment.

Rosyth isn't ideal for various reasons but HMG really need to decide where this refit work is going to take place going forward.

IMO if investment is going to be forthcoming for a dedicated QE refit facility then it should be on the south coast.

[Scimitar54]

Pompey!

[RichardIC]

IMO if investment is going to be forthcoming for a dedicated QE refit facility then it should be on the south coast.

Why?

[SKB]

Because HMNB Portsmouth is a secure MoD establishment, whereas ALL the others are not. And Rosyth is NOT MoD land, its owned by Babcock.

I would genuinely hope Portsmouth's D Lock gets an upgrade for QE and PoW.



Alternatively, converting 2 Basin into a drydock.

(Images: Navy Lookout)

[Aethulwulf]

Bollom did not identify the likely contenders but in addition to Babcock’s Rosyth facility, others expected to be in the running are Harland & Wolff’s facility in Belfast, Able UK’s Seaton Port dry dock, Peel Ports’ Inchgreen Dry Dock in Greenock, and No 5 Dock at Cammell Laird’s Birkenhead site.

I thought he was joking when he said it.

It's not clear that any of the aforementioned yards apart from Rosyth are capable of completing a QE refit satisfactorily without substantial investment.

Rosyth isn't ideal for various reasons but HMG really need to decide where this refit work is going to take place going forward.

IMO if investment is going to be forthcoming for a dedicated QE refit facility then it should be on the south coast.

Dry docking is not refitting.

Dry docking will only be undertaken for a 6 week period once every 6 years to undertake below the water line hull maintenance work, cleaning and repainting.

Any of the 5 yards should be more than capable of carrying out such standard ship maintenance (if they can fit the ship into their dock).

[RichardIC]

Because HMNB Portsmouth is a secure MoD establishment

He didn't say Portsmouth, which I'd agree has obvious merits but would probably cost billions. He said south coast.

[Bring Deeps]

Is it just me or has our national broadcaster changed tack? This report seemed pretty positive.

Indeed the good old BBC managed to say that this was the largest depolyment at sea of F35s anywhere in the world and gave a nice plug to the RAF busting argument that aircraft carriers are mobile airfields so much less vulnerable to the ones located in Albion.

But hang on, isn't this the same BBC that told us that the F35 was flop, the carriers had no planes and they were as leaky as a track and trace app?

Corporation memory is such a fragile thing.

The decent thing might have been to acknowledge that despite all the nay sayers the F35 looks like it is on its way to living up to the hype and that for the first time in 100 years the Royal Navy has both state of the art ships and aircraft to fly from them.

Whilst we didn't see any of that perhaps there was evidence of a new BBC theme 'the Government can't afford as many F35s as they'd like so will have to rely on the US'. To be continued.

I am reminded of a bright but very difficult work colleague from a few years back. If their first argument didn't succeed they would confront you with another which, as often as not, was totally at odds with their first argument.

Thank heavens for websites like this one.

[Poiuytrewq]

IMO if investment is going to be forthcoming for a dedicated QE refit facility then it should be on the south coast.

Why?

Lots of reasons, security is obviously a priority and Rosyth is certainly secure enough but It's a long way to Rosyth to conduct unscheduled repairs, especially if they are propulsion related.

If the investment is going to made anywhere then Portsmouth it should be but there are other options on the south coast if required.

[RichardIC]

But hang on, isn't this the same BBC that told us that the F35 was flop, the carriers had no planes and they were as leaky as a track and trace app?

Corporation memory is such a fragile thing.

More unwarranted BBC bashing.

For around a decade the F-35, and the B model in particular was on the brink.

When did the BBC say there were no planes, apart from when that was factually correct, and when did the BBC report that one of the carriers had a leak, apart from when it actually had a leak?

BTW Ofcom published a report last week that showed, by a huge margin, the BBC is still most people's preferred source for news in a crisis, and all forms of social media (I didn't see this board mentioned) are distrusted.

[RichardIC]

Lots of reasons, security is obviously a priority and Rosyth is certainly secure enough but It's a long way to Rosyth to conduct unscheduled repairs, especially if they are propulsion related.

If the investment is going to made anywhere then Portsmouth it should be but there are other options on the south coast if required.

This is a ship that's meant to deploy globally, so Rosyth is hardly an issue.

Portsmouth, I get, but why other places on the south coast as opposed to anywhere else nationally?

[Poiuytrewq]

Dry docking is not refitting.

Dry docking will only be undertaken for a 6 week period once every 6 years to undertake below the water line hull maintenance work, cleaning and repainting.

Any of the 5 yards should be more than capable of carrying out such standard ship maintenance (if they can fit the ship into their dock).

Thanks, the yards mentioned could conduct the hull inspections, clean, repaint and replace the foul coat etc but how much else? If problems were found (depending on severity) the vessel then have to be floated elsewhere and dry docked a second time to conduct repairs. Seems like a colossal waste of money and highly inefficient.

Between the two QE's how many scheduled and unscheduled dry dockings are going to be required in the next 30-40 years? It's impossible to say for sure but it's likely to be 25+. Investing in Portsmouth would seem like a prudent move over the longer term leaving Rosyth as a useful Plan B if needed.

Just my opinion.

[bobp]

I do not think it would cost billions, to invest in expanding one of the existing dry docks at Pompey even if they need new cranes.

[Bring Deeps]

More unwarranted BBC bashing.

Not really.

Just pointing out that none of the BBC reports I have ever seen about the carriers have ever provided a balanced or particularly insightful view. In fact their tone has been generally negative.

Many people do trust the BBC but the trend is in the other direction.

[Aethulwulf]

Of course the yards can conduct such repairs while in dry dock It is just bread and butter maintenance work that all ships undergo.

With the plan only calling for the ships to be in dry dock for 6 weeks every 6 years, it doesn't make any sense to build a new dock for this work. The dock would be unused for 96% of the time.

The QECs are not going to be put through traditional year long refits. Instead they will have frequent, short maintenance and capability insertion periods while alongside at Portsmouth, as we have already seen. No extra investment required. Certainly spending £1bn to build a new dry dock that would only be needed for 4% of the time is never going to happen.

[Poiuytrewq]

This is a ship that's meant to deploy globally, so Rosyth is hardly an issue.

If the unscheduled maintenance is propulsion related it could be a big issue.

Portsmouth, I get, but why other places on the south coast as opposed to anywhere else nationally?

Portsmouth and Southampton are the only realistic options on the south coast, obviously Portsmouth is preferable.

Amongst the rest and away from Rosyth, Cammell Laird is the only other realistic option.