UK Defence Forum

News, History, Discussions and Debates on UK Defence.

Astute Class Attack Submarine (SSN) (RN)

Contains threads on Royal Navy equipment of the past, present and future.
User avatar
Pseudo
Senior Member
Posts: 1439
Joined: 30 Apr 2015, 21:37
Location: Tuvalu

Re: Astute Class Attack Submarine (SSN) (RN)

Postby Pseudo » 17 Dec 2016, 13:38

seaspear wrote:Is it possible the Los Angeles class though still formidable has been passed in stealth by more modern submarines ,even the latest Russian submarines have been reported as quieter

The latest Russian boats are reportedly formidable, but they have design issues and Russia can't really afford many of them. AFAIK they're looking toward a cheaper design to replace much if the fleet. It's also looking like Borei will likely end at eight boats rather than the planned ten due to the current strains on the Russian military budget.

That said, a change in current US policy in the new year could substantially change Russia's procurement prospects.

User avatar
Repulse
Senior Member
Posts: 2451
Joined: 05 May 2015, 22:46
Location: United Kingdom

Re: Astute Class Attack Submarine (SSN) (RN)

Postby Repulse » 29 Dec 2016, 14:37

The UK are buying more Tomahawkso, but cannot make out how many - the value suggests 2...

https://www.defense.gov/News/Contracts/ ... le/1039153
”We have no eternal allies, and we have no perpetual enemies. Our interests are eternal and perpetual, and those interests it is our duty to follow." - Lord Palmerston

User avatar
Gabriele
Senior Member
Posts: 2000
Joined: 30 Apr 2015, 18:53
Location: Italy
Contact:

Re: Astute Class Attack Submarine (SSN) (RN)

Postby Gabriele » 29 Dec 2016, 14:54

Spare parts only.
You might also know me as Liger30, from that great forum than MP.net was.

Arma Pacis Fulcra.
Si Vis Pacem, Para Bellum

User avatar
SKB
Senior Member
Posts: 6577
Joined: 30 Apr 2015, 18:35
Location: England

Re: Astute Class Attack Submarine (SSN) (RN)

Postby SKB » 10 Feb 2017, 11:26

"PM 'unaware' that Britain currently has NO working hunter-killer attack submarines"
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... z4YHT5VsjT

SDL
Member
Posts: 725
Joined: 30 Apr 2015, 20:52
Location: United Kingdom

Re: Astute Class Attack Submarine (SSN) (RN)

Postby SDL » 10 Feb 2017, 13:04

The Fail & the Sun are the ones reporting this AFAIK.... not sure i'd put any real faith in their reporting TBH.

would be a hell of a snafu if this was correct...

abc123
Senior Member
Posts: 2600
Joined: 10 May 2015, 18:15

Re: Astute Class Attack Submarine (SSN) (RN)

Postby abc123 » 10 Feb 2017, 13:46

SDL wrote:The Fail & the Sun are the ones reporting this AFAIK.... not sure i'd put any real faith in their reporting TBH.

would be a hell of a snafu if this was correct...


Well, sincerely, I do believe them much more than current British defence establishment, at least they will not put fingers in their ears and drone: "Rising defence budget, world-class equipment, 170 billions pounds for equipment, I can't hear you, LA LA LA LA LA..." every time when anyone criticises them...
:cry:
Fortune favors brave sir, said Carrot cheerfully.
What's her position about heavily armed, well prepared and overmanned armies?
Oh, noone's ever heard of Fortune favoring them, sir.
According to General Tacticus, it's because they favor themselves…

Online
User avatar
ArmChairCivvy
Senior Member
Posts: 13348
Joined: 05 May 2015, 21:34
Location: United Kingdom

Re: Astute Class Attack Submarine (SSN) (RN)

Postby ArmChairCivvy » 10 Feb 2017, 15:11

Pseudo wrote:strains on the Russian military budget.

- going down by 10% in rouble terms (they are clever, nothing except optics bought from abroad...OOOPS, oil is the currency, and it has nose dived)

abc123 wrote: 170 billions pounds for equipment

- 68 of that for ships & boats
- more than half of the overall total is for keeping the kit running, so the fashion of calling it procurement is - as one contributer here put it - NSBS

marktigger
Senior Member
Posts: 4597
Joined: 01 May 2015, 10:22
Location: United Kingdom

Re: Astute Class Attack Submarine (SSN) (RN)

Postby marktigger » 10 Feb 2017, 16:32

how many are servicable at minute?

sakaragold
Junior Member
Posts: 6
Joined: 12 Feb 2017, 10:37
Location: Syria

Re: Astute Class Attack Submarine (SSN) (RN)

Postby sakaragold » 12 Feb 2017, 11:13

None of the Astute class boats are currently available. The Navy has confined them to port awaiting a decision on the best way forward to fix severe quality related corrosion issues in reactor coolant pumps and pipework. There is also a huge issue over the source of the lead used to protect sensors in the reactor itself, virgin lead sourced from a deep mine is necessary for this (lead that has not been exposed to the residual atmospheric radiation from the 40's & 50's nuclear bomb tests which is causing the current epidemic of cancer in Western Europe) The MoD failed to understand this specification and allowed cheaper re-cycled lead to be used, consequently the calibration of the sensors was incorrect resulting in inaccurate readings which has caused the reactors to run too hot, which in turn has caused severe propulsion train damage. The numerous, serious design flaws in the Astute class boats have not been fully published by the UK press and there has not been a public discussion ("not in the national interest to let taxpayers know how incompetent, corrupt and treasonous the MoD is old boy" ) Submariners are a suspicious lot and the fact that the Navy is refusing to serve on Astute class boats or the vintage Trafalgar class boats (also in dock) speaks volumes.

Our primary opponent - the Russians - seem to be well aware of the fact that none of the RN's hunter-killer boats are at sea (funny that - how come the Russians know more about these issues than UK taxpayers?) and have twice fearlessly sent their Syria task-force through the Channel over the last two years. They actually stopped 7 miles of Devenport in 2015 and undertook a 4 day amphibious assault exercise! Fortunately the Admiralty was able to despatch a River class patrol ship to keep an eye on them.

User avatar
Engaging Strategy
Member
Posts: 775
Joined: 20 Dec 2015, 13:45
Location: United Kingdom
Contact:

Re: Astute Class Attack Submarine (SSN) (RN)

Postby Engaging Strategy » 12 Feb 2017, 11:31

sakaragold wrote:None of the Astute class boats are currently available.


This does not tally with information I have from sources I trust absolutely.

The Navy has confined them to port awaiting a decision on the best way forward to fix severe quality related corrosion issues in reactor coolant pumps and pipework. There is also a huge issue over the source of the lead used to protect sensors in the reactor itself, virgin lead sourced from a deep mine is necessary for this (lead that has not been exposed to the residual atmospheric radiation from the 40's & 50's nuclear bomb tests which is causing the current epidemic of cancer in Western Europe) The MoD failed to understand this specification and allowed cheaper re-cycled lead to be used, consequently the calibration of the sensors was incorrect resulting in inaccurate readings which has caused the reactors to run too hot, which in turn has caused severe propulsion train damage.


Firstly, where did you get this information? The fact that you're publishing it on a public forum (if it's accurate) indicates that you are either not employed by BAE/the MoD/the Armed Forces or you're in breach of the official secrets act if you are. If you're outside then I would question where you got this information and its veracity.

The numerous, serious design flaws in the Astute class boats have not been fully published by the UK press and there has not been a public discussion ("not in the national interest to let taxpayers know how incompetent, corrupt and treasonous the MoD is old boy" ) Submariners are a suspicious lot and the fact that the Navy is refusing to serve on Astute class boats or the vintage Trafalgar class boats (also in dock) speaks volumes.


This does not reflect reality and on this I can assure you my sources are likely better than yours.

Our primary opponent - the Russians - seem to be well aware of the fact that none of the RN's hunter-killer boats are at sea (funny that - how come the Russians know more about these issues than UK taxpayers?) and have twice fearlessly sent their Syria task-force through the Channel over the last two years.


Why do you presume that there wasn't an RN SSN in attendance? Also the Russians have every right to do that, the Channel is international waters and they have the right of passage through them.

They actually stopped 7 miles of Devenport in 2015 and undertook a 4 day amphibious assault exercise! Fortunately the Admiralty was able to despatch a River class patrol ship to keep an eye on them.


7 miles off Devonport. 5 miles within the UK's territorial waters. So you're claiming Russia's armed forces invaded the United Kingdom's sovreign territory in 2015. Excuse me if I'm skeptical.
Blog: http://engagingstrategy.blogspot.co.uk
Twitter: @EngageStrategy1

Online
User avatar
RichardIC
Member
Posts: 837
Joined: 10 May 2015, 16:59
Location: United Kingdom

Re: Astute Class Attack Submarine (SSN) (RN)

Postby RichardIC » 12 Feb 2017, 12:17

Don't rise to the bait. Don't encourage the little tool.

sakaragold
Junior Member
Posts: 6
Joined: 12 Feb 2017, 10:37
Location: Syria

Re: Astute Class Attack Submarine (SSN) (RN)

Postby sakaragold » 12 Feb 2017, 14:04

Its all true, information that is in the public domain - Daily Telegraph, Guardian, Devenport News, Washington Post, Pravda and other RN forums. I dont need to have security clearance to complain about MoD incompetence, corruption and high treason. Why should we be an international laughing stock about issues the whole world is aware of, except the British taxpayer?

sakaragold
Junior Member
Posts: 6
Joined: 12 Feb 2017, 10:37
Location: Syria

Re: Astute Class Attack Submarine (SSN) (RN)

Postby sakaragold » 12 Feb 2017, 14:10

https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2012/nov ... eaky-rusty
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/201 ... submarine/
http://www.robedwards.com/2016/02/astut ... years.html
https://www.rt.com/news/britain-astute- ... lawed-920/

This stuff has all been previously reported in the British free press. You are obviously incapable of understanding the complex technical issues around operating the obsolete and mis-matched nuclear power plans that were installed in the Astute class. If you want to discuss whats gone wrong, I suggest that you read the COPIUS amounts of information about Astute in the Russian and Chinese press but my guess is you can't read either language

shotleylad
Member
Posts: 34
Joined: 25 May 2015, 08:38
Location: United Kingdom

Re: Astute Class Attack Submarine (SSN) (RN)

Postby shotleylad » 12 Feb 2017, 14:38

You seem like one of the clueless trolls who post rubbish on forums like yahoo.

User avatar
Engaging Strategy
Member
Posts: 775
Joined: 20 Dec 2015, 13:45
Location: United Kingdom
Contact:

Re: Astute Class Attack Submarine (SSN) (RN)

Postby Engaging Strategy » 12 Feb 2017, 16:29

sakaragold wrote:Its all true, information that is in the public domain - Daily Telegraph, Guardian, Devenport News, Washington Post, Pravda and other RN forums.


Because it's written in the papers and on internet forums it's all true. Your naievity is astounding.

I dont need to have security clearance to complain about MoD incompetence, corruption and high treason.


No, but you do need a security clearance to have access to accurate details about the Astute class' construction, reactor and performance.

Why should we be an international laughing stock about issues the whole world is aware of, except the British taxpayer?


If the whole world is aware of the design and function of the Astute class I'd be more concerned about the most serious leak of top secret industrial information in the history of Britain's nuclear submarine programme.
Blog: http://engagingstrategy.blogspot.co.uk
Twitter: @EngageStrategy1

sakaragold
Junior Member
Posts: 6
Joined: 12 Feb 2017, 10:37
Location: Syria

Re: Astute Class Attack Submarine (SSN) (RN)

Postby sakaragold » 12 Feb 2017, 17:32

I'm not trolling anyone. A few brave Times journalists and people like myself want answers, as to why taxpayers are constantly being asked to pour unbelievably humungous sums of money into the bottomless pit that is MoD/BAe... So why exactly do you want this gigantic cock-up covered up? Who's paying your backhanders? The Astute subs cannot keep up with the carriers they are supposed to protect, they can't sprint, the crew are cooking in temperatures of 45deg+, the periscope is no good....i could just go on and on and on.

MoD/Bae incompetence is unbelievable. Having been told YEARS ago of these problems they made NO design changes and just carried on building Ambush, Artfull, Audacious etc as if everything was hunky-dory....it will cost so much more to fix 4 boats than stopping production, fixing the design and then carrying on - thats what Electric Boat in Croton would have done

sakaragold
Junior Member
Posts: 6
Joined: 12 Feb 2017, 10:37
Location: Syria

Re: Astute Class Attack Submarine (SSN) (RN)

Postby sakaragold » 12 Feb 2017, 17:42

And if you want accurate and undeniably top-secret industrial espionage about the Astute class subs, or the Daring class Type 45 destroyers which constantly break down and which will have no anti-ship armament when the MoD scrap their 40 yo Harpoon missiles (with no replacement even on the drawing board) hang around the canteen of any MoD establishment or BAe systems site. There you will hear even more sensitive details of a number of other highly embarrasing cock-ups being openly discussed, which i'm not going to tell you about because you dont have a need to know

User avatar
Zero Gravitas
Member
Posts: 231
Joined: 06 May 2015, 22:36
Location: United Kingdom

Re: Astute Class Attack Submarine (SSN) (RN)

Postby Zero Gravitas » 12 Feb 2017, 17:57

sakaragold wrote:And if you want accurate and undeniably top-secret industrial espionage about the Astute class subs, or the Daring class Type 45 destroyers which constantly break down and which will have no anti-ship armament when the MoD scrap their 40 yo Harpoon missiles (with no replacement even on the drawing board) hang around the canteen of any MoD establishment or BAe systems site. There you will hear even more sensitive details of a number of other highly embarrasing cock-ups being openly discussed, which i'm not going to tell you about because you dont have a need to know


This thread is for ill-informed trolling about Astute.

Please keep ill-informed trolling about T45 to the ill-informed T45 trolling thread.

Caribbean
Senior Member
Posts: 2009
Joined: 09 Jan 2016, 19:08
Location: England

Re: Astute Class Attack Submarine (SSN) (RN)

Postby Caribbean » 12 Feb 2017, 18:32

Yup - disinformation troll.
Russian sounding name - check.
Dodgy location - check.
Articles full of cod science and groundless speculation - check.
Conspiracy theory - check
Recently signed up - check
Ignore/ ban - check
The pessimist sees difficulty in every opportunity. The optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty.
Winston Churchill

sakaragold
Junior Member
Posts: 6
Joined: 12 Feb 2017, 10:37
Location: Syria

Re: Astute Class Attack Submarine (SSN) (RN)

Postby sakaragold » 12 Feb 2017, 19:01

Thats right - cover it all up and sweep it under the carpet old boy!
Lets maintain the myth that the MoD/BAe are an honest, competent and loyal organisation determined to give the UK the finest but non-functional military equipment in the world.
I can't be arsed to try and discuss this topic intelligently with a bunch of Russian fellow travellers dedicated to keeping their heads in the sand and who obviously hope if the taxpayer throws another £10b at the Astute problem, it will go away. Byeeeeee!

User avatar
Engaging Strategy
Member
Posts: 775
Joined: 20 Dec 2015, 13:45
Location: United Kingdom
Contact:

Re: Astute Class Attack Submarine (SSN) (RN)

Postby Engaging Strategy » 12 Feb 2017, 19:16

sakaragold wrote:I'm not trolling anyone. A few brave Times journalists and people like myself want answers, as to why taxpayers are constantly being asked to pour unbelievably humungous sums of money into the bottomless pit that is MoD/BAe... So why exactly do you want this gigantic cock-up covered up? Who's paying your backhanders?


So because I have information, which I know to be reliable because of the source, which suggests that the claims you're making are unfounded I must be taking bribes. Alright sonny. :lol:

The Astute subs cannot keep up with the carriers they are supposed to protect, they can't sprint, the crew are cooking in temperatures of 45deg+, the periscope is no good....i could just go on and on and on.


You could, but that doesn't make your information any less inaccurate.

MoD/Bae incompetence is unbelievable. Having been told YEARS ago of these problems they made NO design changes and just carried on building Ambush, Artfull, Audacious etc as if everything was hunky-dory....it will cost so much more to fix 4 boats than stopping production, fixing the design and then carrying on - thats what Electric Boat in Croton would have done


You do know that the Electric Boat company was heavily involved in designing the Astutes when BAE ran into problems due to the gap in design activity after the Vanguards? This was done prior to the construction of Astute and contributed in significant part to the initial delays and cost increases.
Blog: http://engagingstrategy.blogspot.co.uk
Twitter: @EngageStrategy1

Enigmatically
Member
Posts: 256
Joined: 04 May 2015, 19:00

Re: Astute Class Attack Submarine (SSN) (RN)

Postby Enigmatically » 12 Feb 2017, 21:25

sakaragold wrote: the periscope is no good....i could just go on and on and on.

Well that's both true and rubbish.

Astute submarines do not have a periscope. So just maybe, your knowledge is not as good as you claim

And that is not classified

Online
User avatar
ArmChairCivvy
Senior Member
Posts: 13348
Joined: 05 May 2015, 21:34
Location: United Kingdom

Re: Astute Class Attack Submarine (SSN) (RN)

Postby ArmChairCivvy » 13 Feb 2017, 03:40

Caribbean wrote:Recently signed up - check


Otherwise a good list, but consider the month of August. This is when the "desks" in the troll factory get reassigned, the nic's are created to cover any defence forum of any influence, and the same operator creates several (not on the same day, but close in time) in order to be able to exert a "pull" on the direction of any future discussion that potentially could have propaganda/ misinformation value.
- while waiting for the opportunity, it is good to contribute some facts, so that when "you" do jump in, then there is a thin veil of credibility to it. Newly created ones end up like this poor chap!

This is my last topic contribution on trolling. I consider that I have done my duty to alert the readership... and will now continue with this as my personal hobby, which helps to refocus my mind on the day job ( some people become heavy smokers for the same reason)

Defiance
Member
Posts: 535
Joined: 07 Oct 2015, 20:52
Location: United Kingdom

Re: Astute Class Attack Submarine (SSN) (RN)

Postby Defiance » 13 Feb 2017, 08:32

Bit of a crap troll if he tucks tail at the first breath of opposition

User avatar
Zero Gravitas
Member
Posts: 231
Joined: 06 May 2015, 22:36
Location: United Kingdom

Re: Astute Class Attack Submarine (SSN) (RN)

Postby Zero Gravitas » 13 Feb 2017, 15:46

Defiance wrote:Bit of a crap troll if he tucks tail at the first breath of opposition


Agreed. I'm old enough to remember when trolls did it for love rather than kopeks.


Return to “Royal Navy”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: ddinoz, MarkyMark, RichardIC and 29 guests