Type 26 Frigate (City Class) (RN) [News Only]
Re: Type 26 Frigate (City Class) (RN) [News Only]
Here's a very short interview on Australian TV regarding T26 and UK's recent ship building experience:
https://www.msn.com/en-au/video/watch/b ... vi-BBEMFNB
https://www.msn.com/en-au/video/watch/b ... vi-BBEMFNB
-
- Senior Member
- Posts: 1029
- Joined: 23 Jul 2016, 22:46
Re: Type 26 Frigate (City Class) (RN) [News Only]
https://youtu.be/8ehq5K6y65I
Nice looking video of BAE's proposed digital shipyard for building Australian T26.
Nice looking video of BAE's proposed digital shipyard for building Australian T26.
Re: Type 26 Frigate (City Class) (RN) [News Only]
The VLS layout is rather interesting, its a shame ours wont have 32 Cells. She looks beautiful, definitely better looking than ours.
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Re: Type 26 Frigate (City Class) (RN) [News Only]
Can't we change the next 5 to match the RAN design with CEA radar and 48 mk41 VLS ( quad pack CAMM in 12 ) leaving 32 for aint sub missiles and land strike, then over time upgrade the first 3 to match.
Put aster on the T31s
Put aster on the T31s
-
- Donator
- Posts: 3224
- Joined: 07 May 2015, 23:57
Re: Type 26 Frigate (City Class) (RN) [News Only]
Aster is a no go outside of the T45's. It needs the PAAM system which is a colossal cost. The only SAM T31 will carry is Sea Ceptor which is sensor agnostic and can use a much simpler CMS. The cost and complexity of Sea Ceptor's VL system is also a lot less than Mk.41 and Sylver.Jake1992 wrote:Put aster on the T31s
Re: Type 26 Frigate (City Class) (RN) [News Only]
If we did ditch the CAMM silos forward in place of extra Mk 41 silos on the Type 26, as in the RAN design, we could still retain the dedicated CAMM silos aft of the gas turbine intakes/exhausts for close-in air defence.
Re: Type 26 Frigate (City Class) (RN) [News Only]
Sorry that was my rushed typing was meant to say Artisan.Timmymagic wrote:Aster is a no go outside of the T45's. It needs the PAAM system which is a colossal cost. The only SAM T31 will carry is Sea Ceptor which is sensor agnostic and can use a much simpler CMS. The cost and complexity of Sea Ceptor's VL system is also a lot less than Mk.41 and Sylver.Jake1992 wrote:Put aster on the T31s
I understand the mk41s are more complex and costly but wouldn't it make sence to give the T26 and over all better AAW capsblity with out low numbers of T45s
If even just the front cam silos like mentions above were replaced to give us 32 or 36 mk41s it'd at least make it more flexible
Re: Type 26 Frigate (City Class) (RN) [News Only]
The RAN design has 32 MK41 VLS and there would be approx 8 of these dedicated to quad packing ESSM. This would leave 24 for attack missiles - the same as the UK design. The advantage of CAMM is that its shorter VLS tubes allow for more internal space as opposed to the RAN design. It does seem though that there's plenty of room for upgrades to T26 so anything may be possible in future.Jake1992 wrote:Can't we change the next 5 to match the RAN design with CEA radar and 48 mk41 VLS ( quad pack CAMM in 12 ) leaving 32 for aint sub missiles and land strike, then over time upgrade the first 3 to match.
Put aster on the T31s
UK - 48 CAMM, 24 full strike
RAN - 32 ESSM approx, 24 full strike
Putting Aster on T31 would consume the entire programme cost in one hit. It's not that kind of ship.
-
- Senior Member
- Posts: 4640
- Joined: 01 May 2015, 10:22
Re: Type 26 Frigate (City Class) (RN) [News Only]
we already have the Artisan, the operators are trained on it we have the training facilities. maintenance facilities and spares. So changing the radar would add a huge cost and disruption to the NavyJake1992 wrote:Can't we change the next 5 to match the RAN design with CEA radar and 48 mk41 VLS ( quad pack CAMM in 12 ) leaving 32 for aint sub missiles and land strike, then over time upgrade the first 3 to match.
Put aster on the T31s
-
- Senior Member
- Posts: 1029
- Joined: 23 Jul 2016, 22:46
Re: Type 26 Frigate (City Class) (RN) [News Only]
I agree.matt00773 wrote:The RAN design has 32 MK41 VLS and there would be approx 8 of these dedicated to quad packing ESSM. This would leave 24 for attack missiles - the same as the UK design. The advantage of CAMM is that its shorter VLS tubes allow for more internal space as opposed to the RAN design. It does seem though that there's plenty of room for upgrades to T26 so anything may be possible in future.Jake1992 wrote:Can't we change the next 5 to match the RAN design with CEA radar and 48 mk41 VLS ( quad pack CAMM in 12 ) leaving 32 for aint sub missiles and land strike, then over time upgrade the first 3 to match.
Put aster on the T31s
UK - 48 CAMM, 24 full strike
RAN - 32 ESSM approx, 24 full strike
Putting Aster on T31 would consume the entire programme cost in one hit. It's not that kind of ship.
But I would add that the RAN design also has 8 deck launched anti-ship missiles, but for the UK design the assimption is that ASM would be held in the Mk41 VLS.
By having deck launched ASM, the RAN design will free up 8 silos for use by other missiles. Probably SM2s.
Re: Type 26 Frigate (City Class) (RN) [News Only]
I was think pretty much the same thing, only thing I can really think off is the off sets that go along with the winning bid, as cefar is scalable I was thinking it might be more for T31 along with CEC but don't make much sence if no VLS is going on T31marktigger wrote:we already have the Artisan, the operators are trained on it we have the training facilities. maintenance facilities and spares. So changing the radar would add a huge cost and disruption to the NavyJake1992 wrote:Can't we change the next 5 to match the RAN design with CEA radar and 48 mk41 VLS ( quad pack CAMM in 12 ) leaving 32 for aint sub missiles and land strike, then over time upgrade the first 3 to match.
Put aster on the T31s
Re: Type 26 Frigate (City Class) (RN) [News Only]
It would be nice to standardise on the CEA radar across the RN, RAN and possibly the RCN. It would share risks and costs across more units, thereby lowering the sticker price and making the Type 26 more attractive to Commonwealth partners as well as politicians in the exchequer at home.
However, I’d be loathe to adopt any changes now that would slow the already glacial procurement and build for the first 3 Type 26s and to embark on such a major redesign only for hulls 4 - 8 would create virtually two classes of frigate in Royal Navy service, increasing costs as stated by marktigger earlier.
In short, the standard Commonwealth frigate is a lovely idea, but I fear that opportunity has already passed us by.
However, I’d be loathe to adopt any changes now that would slow the already glacial procurement and build for the first 3 Type 26s and to embark on such a major redesign only for hulls 4 - 8 would create virtually two classes of frigate in Royal Navy service, increasing costs as stated by marktigger earlier.
In short, the standard Commonwealth frigate is a lovely idea, but I fear that opportunity has already passed us by.
-
- Donator
- Posts: 3224
- Joined: 07 May 2015, 23:57
Re: Type 26 Frigate (City Class) (RN) [News Only]
There is space on the UK T-26 for canister launched ASM.Aethulwulf wrote:But I would add that the RAN design also has 8 deck launched anti-ship missiles, but for the UK design the assimption is that ASM would be held in the Mk41 VLS.
-
- Donator
- Posts: 3224
- Joined: 07 May 2015, 23:57
Re: Type 26 Frigate (City Class) (RN) [News Only]
In that case it would be easier to just buy some CAMM-ER. Pretty much the same performance as the latest ESSM.Jake1992 wrote:I understand the mk41s are more complex and costly but wouldn't it make sence to give the T26 and over all better AAW capsblity with out low numbers of T45s
-
- Member
- Posts: 363
- Joined: 09 Aug 2017, 04:00
Re: Type 26 Frigate (City Class) (RN) [News Only]
I hope Australia and Canada pick the type 26, it would be a big boom for the UK ship building industry that has had a horrid track record of exports the last 40 years.
I wonder if winning the competitions would drag the costs down so UK could order the full 13 set.
I wonder if winning the competitions would drag the costs down so UK could order the full 13 set.
Re: Type 26 Frigate (City Class) (RN) [News Only]
That would only happen if we all built in the same yard which is not going to happen, UK will get some revenue from licence build also I'd imagine that AusGov would have contributed towards design for AU variant, but this is where the Canadians can gain a bit from a design point of view, but would imagine any savings would be gobbled up by local build politics.sunstersun wrote:I hope Australia and Canada pick the type 26, it would be a big boom for the UK ship building industry that has had a horrid track record of exports the last 40 years.
I wonder if winning the competitions would drag the costs down so UK could order the full 13 set.
Re: Type 26 Frigate (City Class) (RN) [News Only]
The flow on supply of equipment ,sensors, armaments come from other countries ,a T26 produced in the U.K would likely have a greater percentage of ship from local sources than one produced in Aus., even if a Fremm derivative was successful in SEA5000 how much of it would be sourced from Italy ?
-
- Senior Member
- Posts: 4640
- Joined: 01 May 2015, 10:22
Re: Type 26 Frigate (City Class) (RN) [News Only]
getting 13-16 t26 would be excellent........Crewing them another issue entirelysunstersun wrote:I hope Australia and Canada pick the type 26, it would be a big boom for the UK ship building industry that has had a horrid track record of exports the last 40 years.
I wonder if winning the competitions would drag the costs down so UK could order the full 13 set.
-
- Senior Member
- Posts: 4640
- Joined: 01 May 2015, 10:22
Re: Type 26 Frigate (City Class) (RN) [News Only]
each nation could argue the same thing for their systems being standard across the RN, RAN & RCN maybe even the RNZN however making the design flexible enough that each nation can plug in and play its own sensors would make the design a much better export candidateSimon82 wrote:
Quick Reply
Re: Type 26 Frigate (City Class) (RN) [News Only]
Could you point to where you heard this. As far as I am aware the t26 is VLS only for ASM. Would love to be proven wrong.Timmymagic wrote:There is space on the UK T-26 for canister launched ASM.
The type 26 would be built in Australia and Canada. BAE systems Australia have their own shipyard in Australia and have built a large amount of the Hobart class destroyers for Australia already, which is a bonus to our bid.sunstersun wrote:I hope Australia and Canada pick the type 26, it would be a big boom for the UK ship building industry that has had a horrid track record of exports the last 40 years.
-
- Member
- Posts: 363
- Joined: 09 Aug 2017, 04:00
Re: Type 26 Frigate (City Class) (RN) [News Only]
benny14 wrote:Could you point to where you heard this. As far as I am aware the t26 is VLS only for ASM. Would love to be proven wrong.Timmymagic wrote:There is space on the UK T-26 for canister launched ASM.
The type 26 would be built in Australia and Canada. BAE systems Australia have their own shipyard in Australia and have built a large amount of the Hobart class destroyers for Australia already, which is a bonus to our bid.sunstersun wrote:I hope Australia and Canada pick the type 26, it would be a big boom for the UK ship building industry that has had a horrid track record of exports the last 40 years.
Even if the UK doesn't get to build the type 26s, the cost of research is distributed. Some of subsystems will still be built in the UK.
Re: Type 26 Frigate (City Class) (RN) [News Only]
True. Was referring more to the actual block building.sunstersun wrote:Even if the UK doesn't get to build the type 26s, the cost of research is distributed. Some of subsystems will still be built in the UK.
Looks a little cramped. Maybe in place of the decoy system between the CIWS and Hanger?Ron5 wrote:Hangar roof.
Re: Type 26 Frigate (City Class) (RN) [News Only]
Who ever win the bid it will still be built in the same yard in ADL.benny14 wrote: The type 26 would be built in Australia and Canada. BAE systems Australia have their own shipyard in Australia and have built a large amount of the Hobart class destroyers for Australia already, which is a bonus to our bid.
BAE don't own the yard ASC does along with SAG