Great news.

https://www.forces.net/services/navy/ro ... -agamemnon

Unless MRSS has been substantially more developed than has been made public, I can't see any Gordon Brown style 'final act' with an iron clad contract to force the next government's hand. The £500m in the original article was interesting. Total speculation but used as a budget for a single “Littora...

Pretty clear that it’s another case of “when economic conditions allow” https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/04/20/uk-iron-dome-must-be-more-capable-than-israel/. A British ‘Iron Dome’ would need to be even more sophisticated than Israel’s We must be clear-eyed about how we can defend the count...

I would have a mixture of land and sea based radar sites, though when tensions are high also assume a level of AEW aircraft in the air also. Would assume mobile launcher sites would be the most effective setup. Could additional E-7 have been part of the £10bn IAMDS proposal? Formulated properly IAM...

There is no new money, so it needs to be self funded IMO. If there is no new money then there will be no IAMDS. The existing budget can’t cope with the current commitments. Adding more without an injection of new cash is irresponsible. IAMDS does give RN, RAF and the Army a clear pathway to a lot o...

The practicalities of getting RN another 6 Destroyers with ABM within a decade is problematic to say the least. I’ve got an idea to how to get three and how to fund it. Hypothetically, if BAE was asked to build 5 or 6 Destroyers rapidly to fill a UOR it would cause a crisis in planning and probably...

If the U.K. needs a £10bn Iron Done system with ABM capability the 6x missing Type 45 should the main component of it. Why not ground based? It should be partially ground based especially around nationally important sites and large population centres. £10bn would be a huge amount to spend on GBAD t...

If the U.K. needs a £10bn Iron Done system with ABM capability the 6x missing Type 45 should the main component of it. https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2024/04/20/penny-mordaunt-british-iron-dome-defence-spending-boost/. Penny Mordaunt calls for an Iron Dome over Britain….House of Commons Leader...

new guy wrote: ↑20 Apr 2024, 16:48 It's already been in concept phase

It’s been in the pre-concept phase.

When did it enter the concept phase?

T31 "as is" is cheap because it is simple. Just it. It’s also worth remembering that for every system added the crew allocation rises. It won’t stay at 105 for long if capabilities keep getting bolted on. My main point remains that the U.K. must return to a balanced fleet because that is ...

Is the PM just going to announce the MRSS has entered the concept phase? The Type 32 has been in the concept phase for 18 months and it still hasn’t been funded or show any tangible signs of progression. Great for creating a headline but not exactly the urgency required when both of the UKs Amphibio...

• Captas 4 for T31s and Captas 2 for the RB2s. What would the point of a towed array on the RB2s be? T31 can either carry weapons it self or an armed helicopter to prosecute the sub, what is a River meant to do? Scare it way just by pinging away on its sonar? A valid tactic I suppose. If they were ...

In an effort to move the discussion along a bit. I am pleased you have conceded that at least in the short term RN must make the most of the T31. That’s progress . Optimising the T31 is a totally opposite proposal to coalescing around a Tier1 escort fleet and ditching T31/T32. Different discussion....

Also, you are completely ignoring the threat today, let alone the future. Even with some of the unfunded bells and whistles people want to add to the GP T31 it will not be enough. These ships have been designed to run away gracefully, nothing more. I believe the correct term is "bravely run aw...

Yes there are too few AAW Destroyers, let’s solve that by buying more. When? 2045? Are you wanting build more T45? The T83 is a very long way away. You are overstating the scale - we are talking about a few ships that need to be escorted, a fleet of 17-20 ships could do this also when needed. How a...

I said a T45 was needed here as the primary threat is from missiles and UAVs - that’s exactly what we have now. The Red Sea is a tasking for relatively cheap choke point escorts in numbers as is Hormuz etc. RN don’t have enough T45 to be wasting precious assets on flash points. They need to concent...

The T31 fans here implicitly support this view because most of their arguments involve mythical T31+'s that have had oodles of extra money spent on them. They are no more mythical than extra T26 at this stage. Virtually no one has been more critical of the T31 than I have with the endless missed op...

Two or three T31 for the same £1bn depending on how they are configured would add a lot more. Such a cheap T31, 330 GBP a pop, cannot do any good AAW. Are you suggesting that the T26 will be a more accomplished choke point AAW Frigate than a T31 if they both embarked the same number of CAMM? Why?

You have to plan with the budgets / people you have not what you wish for. That statement doesn’t exactly help your argument for more unfunded T26. We can see that instability already - there are two large competing global pacts now with a sizeable third group of countries such as India sitting on ...

- Do you accept that the RN surface fleet has never been so small and that every vessel capabilities count? Yes - Do you accept that the proliferation of sophisticated weaponry has never been so wide? Yes - Do you accept that money and crewing issues means more of the same is not sustainable? The c...

sol wrote: ↑18 Apr 2024, 08:15 ….it would impact deliveries for RN, and might cause some capability gap….

If two NATO members are combining to replace their ASW Frigates with a bleeding edge top level capability if any temporary gap occurs is it not NATO’s responsibility to fill it?

Repulse wrote: ↑17 Apr 2024, 22:12 Buy the right ships for the job, don’t do it half arsed and don’t pretend buying even more of the same is an answer.

Do you accept that there is no historical precedent in the Royal Navy for what you are insisting is the only way forward?

Shock horror what about some SM6 to go in the Mk41 VLS rather than Aster which don't.* You want to add SM6 to the T31 at almost $5m a missile? Seems unlikely. Not specifically T31, T26 too if we want hypersonic and ballistic on them. What would be cheaper buying from Raytheon or getting MBDA France...

tomuk wrote: ↑17 Apr 2024, 19:38 Shock horror what about some SM6 to go in the Mk41 VLS rather than Aster which don't.*

You want to add SM6 to the T31 at almost $5m a missile?

Seems unlikely.

….If it is mini-sub in Persian Gulf, how about several dozens of slowish UUVs and USVs with active VDS + TASS, with Sat-Com? If it is in a confined water, emerging UUV/USV technology is a bigger threat against submarine much more than a surface vessel. Sounds like a larger deployment than even a T3...